Giants Spring Training: Game 4 Thread

by
Greek Giant

The Giants take on the A’s in the Cactus League today. With their 3-0 record the Giants are evaluating the likes of Jarret Parker, Mac Williamson, Michael Morse and other players on the fringe of the big leagues.

The Line Up

Span CF
Crawford SS
Posey C
Pence RF
Belt 1B
Parker LF
Hill 3B
Nunez DH
Tomlinson 2B

Smarge is on the hill to start.

Please keep Surf Maui in your thoughts today. He is recuperating from major back surgery in a Manhattan hospital.

I’ve got more Guest Posts coming. In the meantime, Play Ball!

 

  • paul in p.v.

    Breckeroni say, Buen suerte, Surf Maui!!!

  • Mr. Sarcastic

    Samardzja in mid-season form already!

    • crawnik

      And I thought Cain would be the first Giants pitcher to give up a dinger. Nope.

  • DrLefty

    There are few things more fun than Jon Miller calling a Cactus League game.

    Top of second: Jon and Estes scramble to figure out who the hell is pitching for the Giants (some lefty named Kraig Stilton). Stilton gets into trouble.

    Jon: Buster goes out to talk to young—well, I guess he’s not all that young. I think he’s a little older than Buster.
    Estes (reading stats): So this guy gives up a lot of hits and a lot of walks. I guess I can see why…

    EDIT: “Sitton,” not “Stilton.” And the way things are going in this inning, I’d say Sitton’s going to be doing a lot of…sittin’.
    /mic drop

    • 610nm

      A Kraig pitching to a Jaff is admittedly a little confusing.

      • 610nm

        Or someone called Ryon.

  • Skweezplay55

    I was wondering this weekend that if the only consideration was determining the five best starting pitchers, what would the Giants’ rotation be? Bum-Cueto-Moore for sure, but who would be the other two? Is there anyone in camp likely to be a better starting pitcher than Samard-Cain? Not based on contract, not based on loyalty (which I know are both important in the REAL world) but just based on ability. Way too early to tell of course, but I would be looking closely at Blach, Beede, and Blackburn. Samard-Cain are veterans, and if they were at or near their best, they would get the nod totally based on ability. However, if either of them are NOT at or near their best, they might not be the ones who give the Giants the best chance to win each time their turn comes up. Anybody have any thoughts on this?

    • Peter Johnson

      Over a 100 Million matters, so Samard-Cain , or safe for now in Cain’s case , in Samard case he has 4 more years on his contract, so he is starting for a long time, plus the Giants love proven starters over prospects, so veterans would have to crash and burn to lose spot, and prospects would have to be perfect just to get a chance at all .

    • cabbie

      Yeah, with all the chatter about Cain and the 5th spot, the most overlooked part of 2016 might have been how uninspiring Samard’s season was. Even his disastrous 2 innings in the post season was mostly erased by the Bochy/Bullpen meltdown of game 4. But he’s going for 200 innings no matter what, so I guess all we can really do is strap in.

      • DrLefty

        You guys are a pretty tough crowd. 200 innings is not nothing. He had an ERA of 3.81, and a lot of his season was considerably better than that–he had a great first couple of months and ended well, too, after a bad middle of the season. ERA+ of 108, which is a bit better than league average. Not bad for a fourth starter.

        • Peter Johnson

          90 Million worth, big money for a 4th starter, the Giants signed him before Cueto, and before trading for Moore, thought they were getting something better then a 4th starter I bet .

          • DrLefty

            Yes, I think they were hoping for more, but it’s not like he was 2007 Barry Zito. And he finished the season well (except for that playoff start). But I’m not ready to throw him in the trash and replace him with Blackburn, either.

          • Keep’n It Real

            We don’t have to consider him as a closer anymore :-))))))

          • DrLefty

            /hugs Melancon doll

            I don’t have a Melancon doll yet. I think I need one.

          • Keep’n It Real

            I was kind of surprised there wasn’t a Moore, Samardzija, or Melancon bobblehead day (so far) this year. A shimmying Cueto is the only player-related offering.

          • Mr. Sarcastic

            Samardzja only gets a snow globe this year…

          • Keep’n It Real

            I saw that.

          • crawnik

            I’m sure there will be a bobblehead of his likeness this year; for which I will jump on that one.

          • Keep’n It Real

            Not scheduled…as of today. Cueto “shimmy”, Retro, and Charlie Brown bobbles this year.

          • crawnik

            Samardzija will probably wind up being the Charlie Brown bobblehead. Good Grief.

          • Keep’n It Real

            LOL

        • Skweezplay55

          Ok, good points. I just wondered if anyone in the wings is better than him. Not that I hate him, just wondering. Also, I really did not feel confident with him starting an important post season game.

        • cabbie

          Good points. I guess I have a lot of memories of balls being hit really hard very often while he was pitching. Not the best statistical approach i’ll admit.

      • John Myhill

        Samardzija was great after he started throwing the curve. He had the 4th lowest FIP of any starter in the majors in September (2.38). His problem was that he refused to throw the curve the first time through the order, that’s why the Cubs bombed him twice. If he can get the confidence to throw it the first time through, he’ll be great this year.

        • channelclemente

          He had the nickname of brick-brain with the Cubs.

          • cabbie

            Yikes.

          • channelclemente

            Would back off from his FB. Seemingly in love with the radar gun. I nicknamed him numbnutz.

          • cabbie

            So is pitch movement his issue? This is anecdotal, but it seemed like when i watched him pitch the ball was pretty much going where he would expect it- just in a straight line that the batter could pretty easily pick up.

          • John Myhill

            Pitch movement was something of an issue but it was made much worse by the fact that until August, 75% of his pitches were fastballs or cutters which were almost at the same speed. There was just no speed variation. That’s why he got so much better at the end of the season.

          • John Myhill

            He only threw it 47% of the time last year, that was the lowest of any starter but Peavy.

          • John Myhill

            I don’t know if that was it. Maybe he didn’t have the confidence to throw it the first time through the order? And in the playoffs people were raving about how Bumgarner held off on throwing the curve the first time through the order against the Mets so maybe Samardzija thought he’d do the same? I don’t know.

  • channelclemente

    Someone needs to take Rob Manfred out behind the barn and talk to him seriously. Tacky-ball is on the way,

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/2017/02/27/mlb-wants-baseball-natural-tack-eliminate–foreign-substances/98483224/

    • crawnik

      Yeah. I read that piece. Manfred the Mann needs to stop tinkering with these changes and just leave well enough alone.

  • totalfan62

    I watched the New Orleans Pelicans vs. my OKC Thunder game last night (well, actually this morning, since it ended after my bedtime). It was the first time I’d seen Demarcus Cousins play in quite some time.

    Cousins is an immense talent. He can hit the outside shot, he’s a beast down low in the paint, and he’s a very good free throw shooter. Reminds me a lot of Nate Thurmond. Unfortunately his attitude and approach to the game doesn’t mesh with the talent. There’s no joy to his game, and when calls go against him he lets it affect his play. The Pelicans are in a bit of disarray. They have 3-4 guys on 10-day contracts, and they’re still trying to figure out how to build a team around Cousins and the very talented Anthony Davis.

    Gotta say, the Thunder look substantially better with Taj Gibson in the mix. Kanter is back way sooner than expected, and he had a strong game last night. I think we have an outside shot at the #4 playoff seed. Thanks for listening.

    • DrLefty

      I think Cousins may be headed for another suspension after his latest T last night.

    • Keep’n It Real

      Cousins is extremely talented! I think his best path to success is having a team and great coach that makes him a “spoke in the wheel” not “the guy”; similar to his role on Team USA. I am hoping New Orlean can be that place for him, but right now I would think San Antonio, Golden State, and perhaps Cleveland would best fit the criteria I mention. My only concern about Cleveland (not speaking as a Dubs fan) is what might happen when LeBron retires or gets hurt. I don’t see Lue strong enough to demand Cousins’ respect without James.

      • channelclemente

        It seems accepted ‘Cousins is talented’, but a slow guy with a 27 inch vertical jump might not be that monumental an asset.

        • Keep’n It Real

          You have just explained why Bogut (potentially) going to the Cavs doesn’t worry me. Zaza and McGee can both get up the court.

          • channelclemente

            Sounds right to me. Bogut might be more valuable, since you aren’t compelled by salary/ego to play him when it isn’t the sensible option. This twin towers stuff, ala Olajuwan-Sampson, just seems foolish to me.

  • Mr. Sarcastic

    Nice innings from Stratton, Gearrin and Law today.

    • John Myhill

      Gearrin was awesome in September last year. Best month by any Giants reliever all season. Unbelievable that they left him off the postseason roster.

  • DrLefty

    Christian Arroyo is starting right where he left off last spring, when he went 10-18, and nearly all of his ABs were off the bench. So far he’s 2 for 2 in 2017.

    • paul in p.v.

      The hit was LOUD.

    • crawnik

      He just continues to go about his business. It will be exciting to see how well he does in Triple A this year.

      • DrLefty

        He just got another hit! 2-run single with the bases loaded, tied the game! 3-3 now.

        Kid’s maybe going to force the issue in 2017.

        • crawnik

          Just like Duffy did.

    • Efrain

      Arroyo will be with the big club this season, believe you me. The kid can just plain hit. The Giants will have injuries and will find a way to get him in the majors.

  • paul in p.v.

    I am pleasantly surprised by both Greenwald and Estes. The former’s voice has matured, and Estes has really gotten his motor mouth under control. He used to give me the itch, but he’s much more tolerable now.

    • Mr. Sarcastic

      Miller busting his chops for the Roger Clemens debacle was great radio …

    • DrLefty

      Agreed on Estes–he’s WAY better this year.

      • Matthew

        That whole ” Fall off of 2nd base because my ankle hurts” is a hill I can’t seem to climb over….not that I hold grudges or anything

        • Peter Johnson

          You and Larry Krueger !

      • channelclemente

        Did you know Moon Duchin when she was post doc’ing at Davis? She’s at Tufts now.

        • DrLefty

          Nope, doesn’t ring a bell.

          • channelclemente

            Mathematician with expertise in drawing voting districts. Who knew.

    • 2holehitting

      I love Estes. Great guy signed my kids glove when he was a Giant years and years ago.

  • paul in p.v.
  • pacman68

    Samardzja and Cain will battle for the dumpster fire award this year.

    • You are in mid season form. How are those Red Martini’s and Lobster?

  • crawnik

    Arroyo. Money.

    • paul in p.v.

      My, my.

  • channelclemente

    Tie ball game. They need to find a place for Arroyo.

    • pacman68

      I agree 1000% but not the bench.

      • crawnik

        Agree. If they could put Duffy at 3B…

        • John Myhill

          It wasn’t the same. McGehee was an absolutely catastrophe, that won’t happen this year, there are just too many 3bmen.

          • crawnik

            What I meant was that Duffy was brought up from Double A and was a hitting machine.

          • Peter Johnson

            Duffy hit .333 in AA, Arroyo hit .273 in AA last year .

          • crawnik

            He’ll be up soon though.

          • Peter Johnson

            Next year, for sure, maybe mid season this season with an injury of low production at 3rd base .

          • crawnik

            Nunez will definitely be looking over his shoulder.

          • Bapah

            The sore one or the other one?

          • crawnik

            Yes.

          • 2holehitting

            Yep Duffy like Panik hit at every level , came up to the bigs and hit there as well. I was sad to see the kid traded

          • The Oracle

            Panik hit .257/.333/.340/.680 during his full season at Richmond.

          • 2holehitting

            Yeah, you picked the one year out of 4 he was off. 6 other stops .297 to .341…..

          • The Oracle

            You said that Panik “hit at every level.” He didn’t. Arroyo’s AA season was actually a little better than Panik’s, as was his San Jose season.

          • 2holehitting

            Technically .257 is better than say most years Crawford hit. So for some .257 is a breakout year……

          • John Myhill

            But without McGehee’s abysmal performance Duffy wouldn’t have gotten a starting position no matter how well he did in ST. And there are too many 3bman ahead of Arroyo now, they can’t all fail.

          • Peter Johnson

            Duffy was called up in 2014 , before McGehee was traded for in 2015, Duffy played 2nd base in 2014

          • John Myhill

            But he didn’t get a serious shot at a starting job in 2014. In 2015 he did.

      • channelclemente

        Step one, be on the bench. Step two, be ready to play.

    • dgg

      Alex throws a damper on this by stating the Giants “would probably need an injury, or big issues at big league level” to install Arroyo at third base this season.

      • Lunch_Box

        He could put a damper on anything with that voice of his….even New Year’s Eve in Times Square.

        • dgg

          Hey Lunch_Box! I like Alex Pavlovic as a writer and speaker. And…he always responds to emails.

    • John Myhill

      This happened with Arroyo last ST also.

      • channelclemente

        He’s blocked at every position, so he’s here for his bat for now. I think he only hit .270ish last year in the minors, he sounds like he’s come a ways.

        • Peter Johnson

          You know this after 3 at bats, might go 0 for his next 20 at bats

          • channelclemente

            LOL. Yep. Could be.

          • Well Peter if in one of our dreams if Nunez was BIG packaged for an impossible to get LF like Conforto or a Yelich or Marte then Arroyo would play third base.

            Remember I did use the word Dream.

            Go Giants. Dream Big.

        • Bapah

          No he’s not.
          None of the 3Bs have anywhere near a lock on that spot.

          • channelclemente

            Nunez at 3B is real, I’d say.

          • Bapah

            Wheel Sea. I’ve had shoulder problems that weren’t serious. It took almost two years to be able to throw without thinking about it.

      • Peter Johnson

        Small sample size, over react a little, Posey 0 for 3 with 2 double plays hit into and a strikeout , should the Giants cut him , Larry Krueger is the king of the over reaction, he changes his mind one day to the next depending on the results of one game all the time .

  • Matthew

    Been working…nice to see that our Spring Overreaction Tour is off to a rousing start!!!!

    • cabbie

      And the haughty reactions to the overreactions!! It is that glorious time of year indeed.

      • Matthew

        Circle of life, Cabbie.

      • HaakAway

        Did you get to see any ST yet?

    • Peter Johnson

      Yep, Larry Krueger would be proud .

      • Larry Krueger – the superb Ex-CFL Scout with Sacramento Gold Miners and NFL’s Arizona Cardinals and caddy to Radnich. At least Raddy lets Larry use a cart when caddying.

  • Peter Johnson

    Just saw the replay of Belt’s HR, pulled it gown the line ,would be in the water at AT&T , keep it up .

  • channelclemente

    If Mark Appel came available mid year from the Phillies, what would he be worth?

    • Peter Johnson

      Not much he was a bust with the Astros .

      • channelclemente

        So was Joe Morgan.

        • steve k

          POTD

        • GSDUbs

          Joe Morgan was a bust with Houston?

          • channelclemente

            Compared to the Reds, oh yes.

          • GSDUbs

            It’s not a relative term

          • channelclemente

            It is to me. Playing for the Astros in those days was mind numbing. One day look at the players who left Houston and had success elsewhere.

          • GSDUbs

            But he wasnt a bust with Houston period. Even in relative terms. He was a pretty decent player who happened to get traded right as he got to his prime. To call him a bust in Houston, even in a relative sense, is way too harsh.

          • channelclemente

            Average. He left in ’71.

            https://i.imgur.com/Ltd0qCY.png

          • GSDUbs

            I’ll give him average.

          • channelclemente

            What happened post Astros was other worldly, IMO.

          • GSDUbs

            No doubt…kind of Lou Brockian, George Fosterian

          • channelclemente

            At least. How do you sustain a .450 wOBA for a season.

          • channelclemente

            LOL. I couldn’t help myself. I’m weak.

            https://i.imgur.com/vN1sLRe.png

          • GSDUbs

            Good stuff

          • giantc

            In each his first three seasons he had an OPS+ over 130 playing a position that was not considered an offensive position in the 1960’s. He also played in a terrible place to hit. I would say he was very far from bust.

        • The Oracle

          Joe Morgan was never a bust.

        • The Oracle

          Morgan finished second in the Rookie of The Year balloting and made two All Star teams as a member of the Astros.

          • channelclemente

            It a comment meant to highlight his phenomenal achievements after he left the Astros. I was an Astro fan at the time, and as far as the fanbase then was concerned, he was expendable. In retrospect, that may bother you, but no one cried about Morgan leaving the Astros until the Reds took off.

          • The Oracle

            You said “bust.” It wasn’t close to being true. What you’re saying now is something different.

          • channelclemente

            It was absolutely true to that long suffering fanbase. What I said was a clarification. You still have Duvall fever, and seem to always want to pick a fight. Maybe some other time.

          • The Oracle

            Ha. You just can’t ever admit being wrong. I like that about you.

          • John Myhill

            It’s pretty hard to deny that morgan was not sufficiently appreciated by the astros’ management.

          • Colt 45’s ?

  • Large Melon Skipper said:
    “Mechanically, he’s very solid,” Bruce Bochy said of Arroyo, who is ticketed for a full season at Triple-A Sacramento. “He’s got a good base, good balance. He’s a good hitter. He’s only going to hit for more power. We’re not looking at him to be a power hitter, but power will come, too.” …

  • Here is my Off Topic Who Is Care – prediction.

    Next Niner QB will be Patrick Mahomes II – son of former MLB Pitcher Patrick Mahomes.

    • Keep’n It Real

      If they trade down or up (into a second Round 1 pick). He won’t make it out of 1st round.

    • Matthew

      Baalke had originally pegged Anthony “No Knees Left” Jackson, a defensive end coming off 14 ACL surgeries, but rates as a “high motor” pick

    • Efrain

      Niners are not going to start the season with a rookie QB unless there is someone special out there.

      They’ll grab a vet and wait to draft the QB of the future down the line, this draft is weak by most accounts.

    • totalfan62

      I predict Shanahan brings Matt Schaub with him, from Stlanta.

      • Matthew

        …which is a downgrade from Kaepernick in many respects

  • channelclemente

    I just had a ‘chat’ with a Dodgers fan who was trying to sell the idea Bumgarner might be a racist.

    • The Oracle

      Why did he think that?

      • channelclemente

        Intensity, and Puig encounters, best I can tell.

    • DrLefty

      Oh, because he mixed it up with Puig before, and maybe another 1-2 Latino players over the years (I remember former Giant Jesus Guzman a few years ago). I was at Petco when he had his moment with Wil Myers, so unless Bum is racist against fellow North Carolinians, that dog doesn’t hunt. But it’s one of those Fake News things that Dodger fans like to say.

    • Matthew

      That sure gets thrown around at an absurd rate….

      • channelclemente

        In many ways, it’s an assumption based on being a North Carolinian. Silly, but out there nonetheless.

        • Efrain

          Not silly at all. Ever been in North Carolina and not be white? Nope right?

          Don;t speak on stuff you know nothing about.

          • Matthew

            Sorry, E…the unsupported claims of racism only serve to hurt the true cause.

            So, you decide here that profiling Bumgarner is acceptable? I guess you must think other forms of profiling must be acceptable by association?

          • John Myhill

            Don’t you know that it’s okay to profile white people, Matthew? Encouraged, even.

          • The Oracle

            If you don’t realize by now that Efrain is a total hypocrite, you haven’t been paying attention.

          • totalfan62

            Word.

          • Efrain

            Who ever said anything about Bum?
            My comment had absolutely nothing to do with him.

          • Efrain

            to clarify last night, my comment was never intended to reflect on Bumgarner. I don’t know anything that tells me he is or not, to me he is just an extremely competitive hot head who plays with emotion, which to me is not bad on this team because too many of the players are quiet types.

            I was speaking on actually having done business in NC and as a Latino from California, I could feel a certain attitude there, so it should not be surprising to some that it may be the case. As anywhere, it does not speak about EVERYONE, but hey it is what it is.

            Hey, you had dudes flying confederate flags in California during 4th of July festivities. You don’t think in a place like North Carolina people of that sort would not feel more comfortable?

          • Matthew

            Thanks for the follow up, dude. I’m not so naive as to think it doesn’t remain a significant problem. It’s cutting more directions. Times are very confrontational. But, all we can do, each of us, is be righteous.

            The fact that random Dodger fans paint Bum a racist is a perfect example of projections that does damage…

          • Efrain

            Thanks for the response. what some dumb ass Dodgers fan says means squat to me. Even on this blog certain players on on other teams get ripped constantly that may be good guys, just part of fandom.

          • John Myhill

            Way to go, e. Why keep your stereotypes in a drawer when you can take them out and show them to everyone?

      • John Myhill

        The problem is that although there are racists in equal numbers everywhere, southern racists are more open about it so ignorant people assume that there’s more racism there. Actually relations between blacks and whites are better in the south because there if a white is friendly with a black, the black can accept it at face value, whereas in the north blacks never know what whites are thinking and are naturally more suspicious.

        • PerSpeier35

          My father in law is the biggest openly anti-Jewish person I’ve ever met. Very odd given that he comes from a large family and none of the other siblings agrees with him at all (fortunately the same with his offspring, one of whom I’m married to). He’s a product of the great depression and as best we can tell he blames the Jews for causing it and profiting from it. Maybe he was influenced while in the military, we’ve never really been able to pin down the true trigger for his bias.

          I agree with your observation about race relations in the south. Years ago I worked briefly with a group of guys from North Carolina. They were loose and funny and friendly, but OMG were they your classic rednecks, about as openly prejudiced toward black people as you could get. My partner, a black guy from Oakland, were the only guys from CA so it was quite a culture shock for us (well, maybe for me anyway). They called him “Terry from Cokeland” and mocked black people even while he was present, they were NASCAR guys, probably had the confederate flag, etc. I felt bad. Terry handled about as well as possible, what do you do with guys like that, there’s no changing them (note, I’m in no way connecting Bumgarner to these kind of guys).

          • John Myhill

            Yes but the upside of being in a cultural setting where racism and anti-semitism are openly expressed is that there is more trust between different groups because people know that nothing is being hidden. As a white is it much easier for me to become friends with blacks if they come from the south because they are naturally less suspicious. As a Jew it is easier for me to become friends with Eastern Europeans than Western Europeans because they are more honest and I know what they are really thinking.

      • BALDHEADSLIKK

        What ive realized most of my life is that most white folks get along well with black folks UNLESS a black man marries one of their white daughters and thats where the problems begin so i’d call that racist.

    • Lunch_Box

      I hate that stereotype that Southerners are racist. It’s a bit ironic.

    • John Myhill

      Realistically, bumgarner doesn’t like a certain kind of expression of competitiveness which is statistically more prevalent among hispanic players, although by no means restricted to them, and this dislike is statistically more prevalent among people with bumgarner’s background. I think this kind of culture clash was a big reason sandoval left, for example (or why greinke left the dodgers, because of puig). But it’s by no means restricted to rural southerners vs. Hispanics.

  • DrLefty

    Oh, and speaking of Petco, this was the park earlier today.

    https://twitter.com/fox5sandiego/status/836400630243577858

  • Lunch_Box

    Thoughts go out to SM.

    • Matthew

      TWG is such a great community…my games, and dinner at Harry Carey’s with Surf talking Giants history, families, blog friends, and this decade of glory was one of my greatest Giants memories.

      Get well, Surf Maui.

      • totalfan62

        Thoughts and prayers, Surf Maui. Get well quick. Opening Day beckons!

  • thefarnz

    My chime in on: A Puig by another color is still Puig.

  • paul in p.v.

    Nice update on the scrubs from The Cove:

    http://www.mccoveychronicles.com/2017/2/28/14742028/the-spring-prospect-ish-roundup-2-28

    Good to know who some of these guys are. At this pace it’s gonna be hard to keep Arroyo down in Sacramento. What if he really is another Posey waiting to happen?

    • 610nm

      Arroyo blazed through A, but went a bit slower at AA. He’s clearly headed to AAA, as they’ll want him to play every day instead of sitting on the bench. WIll his callup come in 4 or 6 weeks a la Mays and Posey, or in September? I dunno, of course, but it is probably handy that Nunez can play some OF. Or, might we see Nunez traded away as happened to Benji Molina?
      I only have prisms, not crystal balls. But difficult depth decisions for position players, starters, and relief pitchers are actually very good things to have.

      • HaakAway

        Indeed the RiverCats appear to be a juggernaut and it will be interesting to see if they live up to that in the PCL. Shaw could be up there at 1B; MyGuy™ Duggar should be the starting CF; Slater in the OF is close to getting his shot at MLB too. The starting rotation seems full of guys that could earn a spot on someone’s MLB rotation if injuries here happen or a trade is needed.

        But wheel sea as Bapah has said from his Hill.

      • paul in p.v.

        I was thinking “Bengie Molina” too.

      • DrLefty

        Posey was a polished college player. Arroyo was drafted when he was 17–no need to rush him while they have Nunez and Conor to hold down the fort. We don’t want Arroyo becoming a free agent at 27, do we?

  • paul in p.v.
    • 610nm

      I didn’t know that was to be shared with the Gophers.

      The Twinkies actually play here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Target_Field
      I have looked inside that stadium, allowed to walk a few steps into the gate, because I was too stupidly scheduled my last visit to MSP during one of their road trips.

      • PerSpeier35

        That a bummer, you’ll have to get back there, it’s a great stadium. My son lives there, we went to a game with him last summer and posted some pics for the gang here. I actually like it better than our park, very nice and convenient downtown setting but the fans actually sit in the stands watching the game instead of wandering around all game long like do many do at AT&T.

  • paul in p.v.

    Today’s word is a keeper:

    procrustean
    1. tending to produce conformity by violent or arbitrary means.
    2. (initial capital letter) pertaining to or suggestive of Procrustes.

    Procrustean entered English in the mid-1600s. The term comes from Procrustes, a robber in classical mythology who stretched or amputated the limbs of travelers to make them conform to the length of his bed.

    • HaakAway

      Hopefully a Third World Problem that is changing with more awareness.
      We need to re-try our attempt at an SJ Giants game. We got some scouting to do!

    • Bapah

      OK. I’ve gone over it several times and one thing keeps jumping out at me. Conformity is one thing. We all like to have things a certain way. Or for that matter…why the hell does he want bloody bodies in his bed in the first place? I can guess.
      More curious to me, however,

      How long was the bed?

      • paul in p.v.

        Not long enough.

    • Skweezplay55

      use it in a sentence?

      • paul in p.v.

        ‘He introduced a procrustean budget that increased military spending by 10%, with no apparent justification.’

        – News @ 11…

    • JStreet

      I thought it was someone who liked lobster.

  • Peter Johnson

    Beckham is starting today in LF for the Giants, did not know he can play Outfield , need to check his MLB game logs.

    • 610nm

      Interesting!

    • Matthew

      Bruce is just trolling the blog

      • Bruce meant 4F not LF

      • That was my reaction! WTF Bochy? Beckham? Really?!

    • earlytimes

      With all the OFers in camp???

      • DrLefty

        Right?!

    • Peter Johnson

      Just read a tweet from Baggs, Beckham has never played LF in MLB, last time he played LF was in the Cape .

    • DrLefty

      He’s never played one inning of OF in the major leagues.

      I totally get it, though. Pence, Span, Gorkys, Mac, Parker, Slater, Duggar, Bernard, and Marrero are not nearly enough choices. It’s important for a career infielder to get that start in the Cactus League.

      /sarcasm

      • DrLefty

        And Morse, who got two hits yesterday. And Ruggiano.

      • Matthew

        I’ll bet his glove is bigger than he is…

      • Bapah

        With idiots like this running the team, I don’t see a way in hell they’re going to win anything this year. I’m ready to pull the plug and save myself some money this year. Ownership should be thinking the same.

        • Bapah

          Too late. They’ve already charged me for MLB-TV this year. (Just looked) Might as well watch, at least for a little bit.

        • Amen Brah.

  • Get well Maui Surf!

  • crawnik

    Here is today’s lineup vs. the Friars:

    Today’s lineup:
    Rollins SS
    Panik 2B
    Crawford DH
    Marrero 1B
    Gillaspie 3B
    Williamson RF
    Hundley C
    Beckham LF
    Hernandez CF
    Bumgarner P

    • paul in p.v.

      Beckham? LF?? Where’s X. Nady???

  • crawnik

    Yes, get well Surf! We need you back in the game.

  • DrLefty

    I think having a million veterans around camp tripping over each other is stupid. I get that you need more bodies with the WBC happening and a longer spring training schedule, but how can you possibly evaluate your choices when there are so many of them that you can’t see what each brings to the table?

    I get what Evans was doing with trying to provide depth, but I think he went a bit overboard.

    • Efrain

      I think it speaks volumes to the Giants inability over the past half decade to produce enough top end talent to bolster the rest of the team, the type of talent that actually led to them having so many home grown starters. The team has has issues with depth for a few years now, which I feel has led to the Dodgers winning the division 4 years. I understand the team drafted well and higher up during the lean years, but we have both also pointed to other team ability to draft while still maintaining winning season on the regular (St.Louis, LA, etc.).

      Yes, I’ve been system for year, and deservedly so. In the past 5 years what do they have to show? No real solution in the OF ss starters, thus the need to bring in so many vets since I don’t think they are very comfortable with Mac/Parker. Pitching wise Heston did well for a short time and Blach last season in a small sample size, but they had to become big time buyers in the FA market. Duffy and Tomlinson as productive INF who can hit. They have not developed a backup for Posey, thus the need to sign Hundley.

      • Peter Johnson

        Giants Management prefer Veterans over prospects other teams management prefer prospects, Giants only go to prospects when they have no other choice , when vets fail to produce, Evans said in Post year presser Giants need to give prospects more of a chance to help them, but it looks like Sabean and Bochy over ruled him .

        • Matthew

          It’s certainly a Giants management team addiction, PJ. No doubt

        • Efrain

          I get that.

          But if say Arroyo rips through ST with another BA hovering around 400 they have to make a move to include him in this years plans. they need to screw starting his clock too early for sake of the team. And once they decide Cain is not the answer, Blach or Beede need to be inserted ASAP.

        • What separates a good Vet from a good Rook?

          • DrLefty

            10-12 years.

          • So you have a loyal efficient Vet who is a few years away from the end and a ROOK who is three – four years a way from achieving the cred of the Vet.

            What factors into the “going with the Rook” when the Vet is still “doing his job”?

            Like teams who have the most/best power hitters. Do their teams always get to the final dance?

          • Peter Johnson

            Here’s the problem Giants Rooks are becoming Vets before they get a chance to play everyday, roting away in the Minors .

          • The rotting image is odd.

      • Do you just cut and paste this?

        • Efrain

          nope but here is an image for you….

          • where

          • Efrain

            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/a8ae9a376e008d08f901c24f3c654db2d5ec7d8be4cd91b82a8b0964a658c3a2.jpg

            Check this out: pretty sad for a 7 year span, specially since after Panik and Duffy, who is no longer here, there is not much.

          • For me it is hard to use the word sad – when drafting is such a crap shoot…

          • Efrain

            I get that drafts are a crap shoot, but the Card, Dodgers and Red Sox have had a good decade and still have way more talent in the farm. The Giants have underachieved no matter how you look at it. And you know this as well as anyone. The graphic speaks for itself.

          • OK but the final final show of dominance is the WS. The Dodgers have not gone since 1982.

          • Efrain

            I know, I don’t need a history lesson on the NL believe you me.

            But a 5th straight NL pennant for the Dodgers is a big time reality, and that is because their farm and 40 man is stronger than the Giants.

            You know this deep down but refuse to say so because you are afraid to really speak your mind on the blog.

          • Would you prefer to win 5 straight NL Pennants or within that time go to and WIN three World Series? Just wondering?

    • Bapah

      I just looked at the roster (Baggerly’s) for today’s game. Where’s Belt?

      • Peter Johnson

        He played yesterday, this is a road game that may be rained out, MLB rules road teams only need to travel and play with 3 or 4 MLB starters, and most teams bring the minimum to road games .

        • dgg

          Oh. That’s the reason the Giants put Gordon Beckham in LF today. They’re going to get rained out!

      • Matthew

        Did you read Crawford’s blog the other day? A great reminder of how Spring works for those regulars…Bochy gave him a schedule and said “mark the games you want to play”…I’d imagine Belt is also in that rarefied group. It was funny how Crawford mentioned not having to take midweek trips to Surprise anymore. Cool stuff

        • Bapah

          Yes, I did read it; leave it to the Village Idiot to immediately forget what he read and then ask a stupid question about it. Thanks for reminding me. I may ask you about it again sometime. Be equally patient, then, as well.

          • Matthew

            Racist moron.

            Wait – I had a moment of Blog Personality Reassignment. I’m back

          • Bapah

            Wait. I don’t get it. Who’s the idiot and who’s the moron?

        • Bapah

          One other thing. Craw is going to Surprise after all.

          • dgg

            Surprise!

          • DrLefty

            It’s different with him because he’s about to leave for the WBC. Needs reps.

          • dgg

            Of course. Smart, Lefty.

        • paul in p.v.

          Anybody got a link to that?

      • He had a pedicure appt.

      • DrLefty

        Belt played yesterday and hit a homer. This early on, they don’t typically play two games in a row.

    • Matthew

      2017 Giants – A Veteran’s Day Parade!

      • DrLefty

        What troubles me is that guys like Rollins, Morse, and Beckham, who should all be in the lower tier of possibilities, are the ones getting lots of reps–I assume because they’re in the Bochy’s Pets Club. In my opinion, guys like Hill, Ruggiano, Marrero and Hwang are a lot more likely to help the team this year, and they should be getting longer looks than guys who were released by their previous teams early last year and should probably retire.

        • dgg

          This is what I hope is going on: These has-beens are getting first and longer looks to be crossed off the list as soon as possible.

          • DrLefty

            Hope is good and necessary for the human spirit. 🙂

          • dgg

            It’s about all we’ve got right now!

          • 610nm

            ‘zactly, dgg. The Giants will want them to feel fairly treated.

        • We have empirical evidence? Haft? Henry? McCauley?

        • totalfan62

          Hill and Ruggiano could be substantial upgrades over last year’s bench.

          • DrLefty

            They really could. They’re both on my early My25Man™ roster. They’re versatile, experienced, and have pop.

            Since Hwang is willing to go to AAA, that’s probably what should happen, but I’d also like them to take a good look at Marrero, who had a great year for the Red Sox AAA team last season.

        • Matthew

          i think it’s more of a typical Spring Training assessment. It’s 2/28…so let the old guys show what they have concurrent to watching the new guys in side sessions, split squad games, and so on.

          If, on 3/28, too many young rising talents are reassigned, then we can officially worry. But it’s simply way, way too early to read tea leaves.

          • dgg

            I thought reading tea leaves is what My25Man Guys is all about.

          • Matthew

            Yup!

            I just don’t think we should read too much into lineups on 2/28…that’s all

    • crawnik

      I couldn’t agree with you more with Evans going a bit overboard.

    • They have tons of acreage on back fields. This gives the parent club a way to establish Giant protocol before they all go to their AAA-Short seasons. Perplexing to fans possibly but doubtful about the “stupid” reference, no?

      • dgg

        Stupid works for me.

        • A Montana brain freeze would work for my Canadian neighbors ala Forrest Gump. 🙂

          • dgg

            I’m not sure what you’re saying here, ClutchUp. I think we’re in agreement on Morse, but not so much on Rollins.

          • None of us know for sure what motivates Giants brass to so obviously isolate their spring training game plan.

            I do know that after the season is over Larry Baer and the Investors have three separate mandatory meetings at three different sites (all paid for). The investors attend and 45 Giants Regional Scouts and 135 Cross Checkers attend along with the usual suspects.

            They are not directly back to back to back.

            At these events not one person is not allowed to speak their mind or their peace. Jack F. Bair and the Giants legal team attend. Director of Player Development – Shane Turner is asked thousands of questions. Vice President and Assistant General Manager of Scouting and International Operations – John Barr brings all his staff. Felipe Alou brings all of the Dominican Academy staff to all three of these meetings.

            Of course all on the field ML staff members attend as well as coaches from all the different minor league levels of play.

            http://sanfrancisco.giants.mlb.com/team/front_office.jsp?c_id=sf

          • dgg

            That’s an awful lot of people. What’s the purpose of these meetings?

          • All baseball OPs who run billion dollar enterprises have similar meetings. Standard Operating Procedures. They talk over everything. That is what makes me smile when the 198 of us – seem to always have a better way, but I get it. Fan is short for fanatics.

      • DrLefty

        I read that they had to add an overflow area in the locker room because it’s not big enough for everyone who’s there. Baggarly said he’s never seen so many veterans in camp for so few jobs, so I’m not hallucinating.

        • I heard seven guys are dressing in Osich’s RV. Total SRO only.

      • Bapah

        Well, not really. They’re real estate challenged at Scotty Stadium, but they do have access to lots of acreage just up the road a piece.

        • THAT’S it. Casa Grande was the best.
          75 yrs. Ago

    • cynic

      And how about displacing or blocking the youngsters?

      • totalfan62

        I agree with Lefty’s comment, and especially with cynic’s add. As Lefty and others have often said, we spend far too much time chasing that little bit left in the tank of older, declining players…at the expense of developing our rising younger players. Those youngsters look at how we do it, then see how their contemporaries with other teams get a better shot at making the 25-man. It’s an issue, no doubt.

    • The Oracle

      When you have veterans, you don’t need to worry about evaluation because you know that any veteran is automatically better than any young guy. Or at least that’s what Bochy told me.

      • Who has the bigger head? You or the Skipper?

    • Keep’n It Real

      If they leave AZ with the deepest/strongest team possible, then I’m okay with any overflow of players in Spring Training. I think it says a lot that so many players want to be a Giant and with their history of finding gold nuggets in the veteran scrap heap…why not? I would agree with you if this team was in flux (from a roster standpoint), but there are only a few positions open and having a number of options to choose from isn’t a bad thing. The youngsters that might be impacted were destined for the minor leagues, anyway.

      • Peter Johnson

        Destined for Minor leagues my ass, never given a fair shake you mean, Cain will win 5th spot , not because he is better then Blach, Beede , no , just because he is a well paid veteran that’s it .

        • Keep’n It Real

          I don’t think the overflow area in the locker room is for starting pitchers, so my statement still stands.

          • Peter Johnson

            Parker and Williamson, will never get a chance with guys like you, the older guys fighting for that spot are way long in the tooth way on downside of career, same thing in the infield, Conor proved his worth in Post season, Rollins and Hill way beyond good years, the Korean kid I would give more of a look, but Kelby needs to be given a chance .

          • Keep’n It Real

            Yep…it’s all my fault. I’ll get off your lawn now.

        • Matthew

          I wish you tweeted! All caps.

      • DrLefty

        My concern is that because so many guys are fighting for opportunities in the Cactus League, they won’t get a good look at anyone in particular and will be choosing on reputation rather than current ability to help the team. This is where “less is more” makes sense. If, say, you have 3-4 guys competing for one spot, you can take a careful look at all of them. But when you have 8-10? You’re making decisions based on just a few ABs, good or bad.

        • Keep’n It Real

          That’s fair 🙂

  • dgg

    Thinking of you Surf Maui. That’s tough what you’re going through. Get well soon.

    • 610nm

      I trust Greek Giant will update us appropriately.

  • dgg

    George W. Bush in his first speech to Congress stated, “Too many of our citizens have cause to doubt our nation’s justice when the law points a finger of suspicion at groups instead of individuals. All our citizens are created equal and must be treated equally. … racial profiling [is] wrong, and we will end it in America.”

    • Bapah

      Well, not only is that water under the bridge… the bridge has been washed out.

      • dgg

        Surely not. I have to believe “the better angels of our nature” will prevail.

        • Bapah

          I’ve always been one to anticipate and plan for the worst and, then, hope for the best.

  • dgg

    From Alex, injury/wellness update:

    “Will Smith (elbow) threw off flat ground and everything went fine. Eduardo Nuñez (shoulder) will likely resume playing third base later this week.”

  • Bapah

    Has anyone here eaten at the Liholiho Yacht Club? Heard it’s fantastic and would like a report before I come north next.

  • Surf Maui

    Here’s a picture from my room at the Hospital for Special Surgery in NYC. Being discharged today following back surgery . I expect to be ready for Opening Day

    • Surf Maui

      You’ll just have to use your imaginations since the photo won’t load

    • DrLefty

      Good to hear from you!

    • Matthew

      You are the the Black Knight if the blog, Brother! Welcome “back”

  • paul in p.v.

    Probably this has already been discussed, but I’m happy to read that Bob worked out in the offseason:

    https://brandon.mlblogs.com/dont-ever-think-you-ve-made-it-brandon-belt-7aafadef1bb4#.tult2nfx7

    I think he could easily become a complacent tub-of-goo, especially now that he’s been extended. This blog is good news.

    • DrLefty

      I somehow missed that one, so thanks for posting it!

      I like hearing that he’s working on his base running. For a guy who had nearly a .400 OBP and walked a ton last year, if he can take extra bases and/or get a few steals, it really will help the team.

      • Mr. Sarcastic

        It’s only been 4 ST games, but the Giants seem to really be taking the coaching from Vince Coleman to heart so far. Aggressive and smart base running/stealing will be a nice added dimension to their game and fun to watch too…

        • Matthew

          I prefer a picture of Puttanesca Arpeggio with a fig reduction relish from Bon Apetit’

    • dgg

      Do you know what’s the picture in those two blurry photos?

      • Bapah

        Blurry? If you’re talking about the blog referenced, it’s left field berm at Scottsdale.

      • paul in p.v.

        Dunno – how are your glasses? ;o)

        • dgg

          My glasses are fine, paul, and so’s the resolution on the pictures I take.

  • paul in p.v.
  • giantc

    I heard Baggarly on the radio say even if Cain has a 6.50 ERA in the Spring he fully expects him to be the fifth starter. That is great!! They will then give him at least two months of getting shelled while he tries to find his “release point.” The Giants have good options for the back of the rotation but they will likely be in Sacramento until mid Summer unless Cain is injured.

    • DrLefty

      We’ve discussed this a lot, but it’s really frustrating after what happened last year. In the past, when they’ve “stuck with” guys like Zito or Cain, they could make a fairly truthful statement that they had no better options, so they had to ride it out.

      It is glaringly obvious that this is not true this year. Both Suarez and Blach pitched better last year, and there’s Blackburn and Stratton and maybe even Beede ready to go.

      Whatever excuses they give, it can’t possibly be because they think letting Cain get shelled is the best/only thing the team can do.

      • Isn’t it like somebody new hitting .500? should that guy be in the LU?

    • Isn’t it like somebody new hitting .500? should that guy be in the LU??