Giants Swept By Mets As Spiral Into Oblivion Continues

by
Greek Giant

Some Numbers:

  • The Giants lost for the 12th time in the past 13 games
  • The Giants team ERA is 6.00 in June
  • The Giants are on a pace to lose 106 games this season
  • The Giants, in last place, are 24.5 games behind the Dodgers, who are in first place
  • The Giants have a -107 run differential, second worst in the Majors
  • The Giants team ERA for the season is 4.82, 12th in the NL
  • The Giants are 27-51, for the first time since 1902

I could go on. There is no need to really but seeing the hard numbers reaffirms all the anger, sadness, and doubt of this baseball team we all feel. It is all so very sad. I’m sure Bochy is at his wit’s end. This is un-precedented run of futility in the history of the franchise, dating back to the New York years.

As a fan, what I need most right now, apart from a win, is a statement from the front office that reassures me. I need them to tell the fans they are on top of this, that this season, this losing will not stand and that it will be fixed immediately for the short and long terms.

Right now, the silence and denial from the front office bother me as much as all the losing does, to be honest. I think the Giants are paying the price for having ownership by consortium. Surely if there was one owner, there would be more vocal, and perhaps better leadership.

  • paul in p.v.

    Brisbeeroni’s not even readable:

    https://www.mccoveychronicles.com/2017/6/25/15871448/sf-giants-bad

    (and he’s so disgusted he’s not even proofing before he posts).

  • Foothills A-rye-o

    Breckeroni was moved by the following line:

    “Right now, the silence and denial from the front office bother me as much as all the losing does, to be honest. I think right now the Giants are paying the price for having ownership by consortium. Surely if there was one owner, there would be more vocal, and perhaps better leadership.”

    Well said, well done, and probably spot on.

  • DrLefty

    Just woke up (kid forgot the time difference and texted me at 5 a.m.) and came here to talk about the Rosenthal article, which I see TO posted on the other side, but here it is again:

    http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/story/san-francisco-giants-find-nothing-is-routine-in-troubled-2017-season-062617

    As TO said, and in fact as Rosenthal said, these things are easy to notice when a team is losing. And even if there’s some tension with Melancon, the team was bad in the second half of last year, too.

    Still, it was interesting to get some outside perspective of what’s gone wrong because we’ve all sensed that something had to be. I wouldn’t probably have predicted Melancon being a problem–he seems like a great guy from everything I’ve seen–his Twitter presence, his Players Journal piece after he signed with the Giants, his interviews–but now that I think about it, it makes some sense.

    Melancon makes around $16 mil per year in his new contract. That’s more than sixteeen times what most guys in the bullpen make. So he comes in, having made ALL the money, and tries to tell people who’ve been here longer (Kontos-five years; Strickland-3 years, etc.) what to do?

    Some (again, perhaps Kontos or Strickland) may even feel that he’s stolen their chance to make more money. The previous bullpen with the Core Four was not about the big dog. It was about the Core FOUR, and they were all well-paid for relievers. They were paying $20 million just to Romo, Casilla, and Lopez last year. You might not aspire to a Melancon deal ever, but maybe you can aspire to the kind of money Lopez and Affeldt got in their final years. But not if one guy’s using up the whole bullpen budget.

    Anyway, it’s interesting. I agree that it explains next to nothing ON the field, though.

    • Foothills A-rye-o

      Aloha!

    • radicalpro

      Weird. Isn’t this the type of thing that Bochy or maybe a clubhouse leader should take care of before it becomes an issue (if it even is one)? That quote admitting that he dropped the ball and take for granted doing things his way seems to add credence to the idea that maybe he’s been around a little too long now.

      • DrLefty

        Well, he was in the hospital having an emergency heart procedure a couple weeks into the season. That could explain some things running on autopilot.

    • Thanks for posting this. My favorite line is this one:
      “Some with the Giants muse that the team even misses Angel Pagan, who created an odd sort of unity because most of the players disliked him.”
      It made me laugh hard. Obviously, no matter how much Pagan was disliked you have to hold him accountable. He is kind of having the last laugh this year. I do find it very telling that he received zero offers from other teams so there is that!

      • Efrain

        That’s not true entirely Greek, word is Pagan received calls but he wanted a certain about of $$$$ (5M?).

        I’m sure he was smart with his money and is living well in PR with his kids and felt it was not worth it to stick around.

        I can also tell you that he has been twice the baseball player the crap the Giants have thrown out in LF this season. Maybe not today, but he was a good talent at one point. Guys like Parker and Mac will never ever have collectively the career that Pagan had.

        • That makes me feel better to know some teams were interested. To me $5m seems very reasonable for Pagan and I still don’t know what the reality is though. It bothers me that he has a bad reputation and we don’t know the specifics. It still sounds like a lot of gossip.

        • I disagree with your summation of Pagan’s skills in the last line of your post though:
          “I can also tell you that he has been twice the baseball player the crap the Giants have thrown out in LF this season.”

          Pagan is 10 times the player compared to most, if not all of those the Giants have trotted out in LF this season!

        • Sgbssfg

          Me also wanted a major league contract.

      • Bleacher Bob

        What does Pagan’s agent say about an interview with TWG?

        • I’ll look into it. He would be a good get for us. Thanks for the suggestion.

    • Efrain

      The one thing that jumps out to me is that this is not necessarily a Mark Melancon problem. I’ve was never into singing him becuase I never cared for his style and at his age saw more available closers out there that I think are better. Simple argument

      The main thing that jumps out to me from the article is the that Giants, as have pointed out multiple times/

    • Foothills A-rye-o

      It seems like it’s going to be really hard to move Melancon. This is not looking good. Giants would have to eat a lot of that contract and other teams would still have great pause about acquiring him.

      • Efrain

        see below, it’s a team issue.

        It’s not always so cut and dry. At team that needs a reliever will still look into him.

        I’m not the biggest Melancon fan but have you ever read anything disparaging about him from Colorado? Nationals? Pirates?

        The issue may be the team and idiots like Strickland.

        • Foothills A-rye-o

          The issue about being able to unload Melancon has a lot to do with the number of other bullpen arms available. A team like the Nats can go out and acquire mulitple relievers on expiring or less heavy contracts. Seems to be a buyers market developing with strong supply.

    • Kramerica

      The thing preventing Kontos from getting more money is his performance. His tenure with the Giants has made him plenty of money (in everyday terms, not big league money) and he’ll be able to float around MLB as a RP for several more years I’m sure. And continue to do so with incredibly mediocre stuff while giving up inherited runs left and right.

      • Matthew

        His performance hasn’t been nearly as bad as this blog thinks. And, his performance this season is a bit better than Melancon

        • Eric Ritz

          True. I don’t think I could even say Melancon has been a top 5 Giants reliever this year. Strickland, Osich, Kontos, Gearrin…maaaaybe Melancon sneaks in as the 5th, but my god that is no feather in his cap.

    • livfreerdi

      “I dropped the ball” — Bruce Bochy. Look, the biggest problem is that there are virtually no consequences for these professionals checking out this season, most of all Melancon.

    • Matthew

      My take is this:

      Rosenthal and the “national TV crew” showed up in SF last weekend, and were probably shocked at the total demise of this franchise and were also shocked at the funereal atmosphere…Rosenthal poked around in an attempt to find out what happened. Nothing stood out and everything stood out.

      On here, we have dissected in great detail and I think folks from every side of the argument seem to have valid points. It’s lack of performance, it’s lack of talent. It’s confusion. It’s upheaval. It’s risks that failed. It’s injuries. It’s poor planning…it’s a malaise that has sucked the life out of a group of players that are walking around shell shocked.

      • Hoona

        I agree. The thing to take away from here are the quotes from Evans, Boch and Melancon. Rosenthal’s interpretation of what went wrong is as good a guess as ours honestly

    • Hoona

      Quite frankly, I think it’s ridiculous to blame the bullpen’s malfunctions on Melancon’s warmup routines being different from that of a team. That’s an unfair assessment and blame placed on one player for the situation.

      As far as the team being quiet, we all know that Posey isn’t a boisterous guy, and neither is Bochy, wh’s quite reserved himself and not the most outspoken manager out there. That’s not the problem with this ballculb

      The thing that sticks out to me are Evans’ quotes on the situation. Anyone notice how he’s extremely defensive and just floats around the issue? Guess who brought that connectivity and “unique personality” that the team is missing these days: Matt Duffy

  • The Oracle

    Regarding the team ERA of 4.82… the worst team ERA for a full season in franchise history was 4.86, which was set in 1995. A little respect for history, please.

    • DrLefty

      Too early to tell, but I’m gonna say Bumgarner’s return is going to mess that up. He hasn’t had an ERA out of the 2s since 2013.

      I predict Bumgarner may start the first game after the All-Star break. Three innings last night–usually in spring training, they only go one in their first start.

      • Foothills A-rye-o

        How about Duggar? Maybe starts 2nd half back with San Jose and Reynolds and Jebavy get promoted to AA. Or do you think Duggar goes straight to Richmond when he is ready?

        • DrLefty

          Going by previous patterns, I’m guessing a few games at SJ to get his timing back and then off to Richmond. He did spend two months in Richmond last year.

      • Eleuthero

        Bumgarner’s return may, indeed, “mess up” our historically high team ERA. I would welcome that “mess up”.

      • radicalpro

        I actually hope they shut Bum down for the rest of the season. Coming back from injury, with a finite number of throws in an arm, why waste it on a lost season? FO won’t do it though since he’s a marquee player that they figure fans will want to see.

        Could be a chance to see Gregorio or Beede (and hope Beede’s recent struggles are PCL related).

        • Foothills A-rye-o

          I’d say it’s high time for Gregorio. He’s amassed over 180 IP at the AAA level. Good #s this year. It’s time!

        • Kramerica

          I agree 100% but it won’t happen. If he’s healthy it’s nearly impossible for the organization to tell him we’re shutting you down. And he’ll have extra motivation because he feels partly responsible for this team’s demise. This wasn’t going to be a playoff team with him, but I doubt they’d be circling the drain in a death spiral *this* badly with him. I just hope they are very, very cautious with him.

        • DrLefty

          They won’t shut him down, but I’m sure they won’t overwork him, either. I think he needs to pitch–they need to make sure he’s the same guy after the injury. And I’ll admit as a disheartened fan, at least his starts would give me something to look forward to.

          As for Gregorio or Beede (more about Beede in a minute), there are plenty of opportunities to take a look at them if the Giants want to. Cueto could get traded. Moore has the worst ERA in baseball. Cain’s been awful since April. Even Blach’s last few starts have been rough.

          There was an interesting Twitter exchange the other day where a fan asked Baggs about Beede and Baggs disparaged Beede because of this last couple starts. In pops Beede’s dad, Walter, saying “Wouldn’t you like to know what he’s been working on in AAA?” Baggs said yes, I absolutely would, please message me. It’s useful to remember that minor league stats aren’t always what they seem.

          • radicalpro

            Good to know, hopefully that is the case that he’s just working on things. I’ll have to check Baggs if there’s an update. I know Beede tinkered with a sinker/two seamer a couple years ago so I’m glad he’s at least up for trying things. Seems coachable.

          • livfreerdi

            But there have been many cases where pitchers who were forced to sit out a year for one reason or another came back much stronger. There just is no good reason to pitch him even 1 inning. Spring training 2018 will be too long, just like all of them. Plenty of time to see what he has

          • DrLefty

            If they want to extend him, trade him, or bolster the rotation behind him, it’s important to know if he’s still the same guy he was before the shoulder injury. All of that could well be under consideration before 2018 camps open, especially if Cueto’s gone.

          • The Oracle

            Who were the pitchers that weren’t allowed to pitch, despite being healthy?

  • Eleuthero

    I think the first casualty of the Giants disastrously bad play this season will show up as a serious decline in season ticket sales. As for casual fans, they can score tickets now for $7 a pop as shown by a poster on this blog. That’s a serious discount but is representative of lack of demand to see the team. It also represents a loss for the original ticket buyers who want to get anything they can get for their tickets. These are not auspicious signs.

    • Keep’n It Real

      “dynamic pricing” will mean “I’m trying to negate losses as much as possible”.

    • DrLefty

      Schulman was talking about this on Twitter the other day. On the one hand, they have a big waiting list for season tickets. On the other, it’s harder to decide to buy them if the secondary market is weak, since no one goes to 81 games.

      We were astonished to learn a few days ago that our number came up for season tickets for the Warriors. We signed up a couple of years ago for the list before the first championship, mainly to get presale opportunities for mini-packs and playoff tickets. The waiting list is now 41,000. We’re trying to decide whether to go for it, and a huge part of the calculation is the secondary market. For the Warriors for the next few years (great team + new arena) that looks like a pretty safe bet. For the Giants, though?

      • Bleacher Bob

        Lots of tix on StubHub will expire at the $6 lowest price unsold. Season tix holders who could go to a few games every year, sell the rest on StubHub, and make $$ will not make $ next season and will not renew their tix. That Giants waiting list is going to evaporate.

        • DrLefty

          I think that’s right. They don’t have a waiting list of 41,000 like the Warriors do.

        • Surf Maui

          But have to buy a seat license

          • Bleacher Bob

            Warriors in the new arena for sure. No seat license for me for Giants.

      • Kramerica

        I’m certainly not asking you to divulge any numbers but I’m curious as to how many games you would have to sell to break even. Since there are 41 home games I would imagine selling half of them (or even less) could net you even. And, with the playoffs (particularly if they get to the Finals and face Lebron a fourth time) selling a handful of games could get you to break even for the purchase of all playoff home games. What an interesting (and wonderful) dilemma to have.

        • DrLefty

          I don’t know the numbers yet–we got an invite to a seat selection/purchase opportunity at Oracle at the end of July. But I did talk to my brother, who had season tix about 10 years ago and let them go (his financial situation got worse and he couldn’t keep up the annual price tag), and he knows several long-time season ticket holders.

          He literally told me he knows one guy who put his kid through college on the profits from re-selling Warriors tickets. I’m guessing maybe that was CSU East Bay and not Stanford, but still. People use Warriors tickets as an investment. He said he’d go for it if we can swing the upfront costs, which we probably can.

          We’ll go to the event and see what the deal is, but we’re leaning yes if we can swing it. It seems like a unique period in time with the way the team is and a fantastic new arena that people will be clamoring for seats in. We can always let them go later once we retire.

          • People in Miami have been doing the same with Heats tickets. The profit from selling most of the season tickets online is huge. I spoke to one holder of season tix when I went to a game last year and he was telling me he sells most of his.

          • Bleacher Bob

            10 Giants tix in 2012 put a down payment on a house. I’m guessing you could go to a few interesting games (10) and sell the rest and make $.

          • Keep’n It Real

            I heard a GSW season ticket holder (on the radio) talking about how much $$$ he makes on his season tickets. He also said he intends on purchasing in SF (much pricier), because they’ll be even more folks wanting to go after work, etc.

          • Surf Maui

            My son has had season tickets to the Cubs since the year after the Steve Bartman game. Seats have gradually improved (and gotten more expensive) over the years till now they are very good (and very exclrnsive). Money loser until the last three years– now not

          • GSDUbs

            Coming from a split season ticket holder….Be advised regarding selling tix – more specifically, regular season tix to pay for the excessive cost of playoff tix – comes with some interesting dynamics. I don’t know just how good (expensive) the tix you’re considering buying are, and in no way trying to dissuade you so as not to be a Debbie, there’s another side to this…

            Not the least is trying to sell tix in earlier playoff rounds. Many season ticket holders have a hard time making money on these games (some do, some not as much…I think a lot depends on the price point of the tix) because people have become so spoiled that they would rather wait until the conference finals/NBA finals before shelling out big dollars. After all, who wants to pay the money to see the Houston Rockets in game 3, round 1? Anyway, there’s more to this than meets the eye not the least of which (and I don’t know your cost threshold) is continued rising costs of tix year after year. And it’s still a few years off from moving to the new arena if that plays a big part in all this.

            One last tidbit from my personal perspective: if you have season tix to sell for many of those annoying Wednesday nite games against Charlotte and maybe even want to sell a few early round playoff games to afford those high cost, later round playoff games, or to cover the cost of next years tix for example (yeah, just check out how much those cost and how much they have gone up the last 3 years), or simply give in to temptation and sell tix for NBA finals game 5 because you can make so much money (gee, I can pocket 8k for my 2 tix and stay at home and watch a game on tv…and if they happen to lose that game, I wont have to kick myself) – then what’s the point of having season tix in the first place? Those early round games are a different animal than the last 2. Certainly, if money is no object and you can identify with the “fan” who purchased 2 tix to game 5 140k, none of this matters.

            And even then, if you live in the South Bay (me) and have to go to a weekday game up 880, you might think twice about going even if the tix were compted to you.

            And lastly regarding the 41k wait list, it’s cheap to get on the list. But once a lot of those names called ahead of you get contacted, and they are confronted with cost, the list shortens up very quickly on its way to you.

            Good luck…hope you decide to be out there next year with the rest of Dub Nation.

          • DrLefty

            Thanks very much. That’s a very helpful perspective. We’re definitely not in the “money is no object” category. If we were to do it, it would be so that we could go to the games we want and give tickets to family as gifts without having to pay a fortune on the secondary market. Resale would be about breaking even or maybe slightly more, not funding our beach house in Maui (the one that exists only in my imagination).

            I really wanted to go to a Finals game this year, and when I got the presale opportunity, the cheapest nosebleed seat was $500. We watched on TV.

            We were around #7200 on the waiting list when we got on the list in early 2015 (for $100 per seat, which I thought was cheap to get the presale opportunities). For the 2015-16 season, we moved up to around 5000. For the 2016-17 season, we moved up to 3000. So at that pace, I figured we were just 1-2 years away, but it moved even more quickly than I thought.

      • Matthew

        I have a friend who has been fortunate enough to have season tickets for the Warriors for over 20 years…so, though it’s not necessarily a good comparison, he made over $20,000 profit in the regular season, and…..over $100K for the 9 playoff games. Obviously, he’s not a big fan, because he sold most all of his games. And, he’s courtside. But, I tell this story to point to the current market being hot, and the SF move could heat it up.

        Just do it

        For the Giants – a big helping of Nope

        • DrLefty

          Thanks. That’s what we think, too. I imagine we’d be nowhere near courtside, but if it’s like how the River Cats tickets work, every year you move up the list and get opportunities to buy better seats. By the time the Chase Center opens up, we could have moved out of the nosebleeds, at least.

      • Watchingsince62

        Related to tickets, I just received my annual rejection letter from Augusta, informing me that they “regret” that my entry for Masters tickets was not chosen. Frankly, I don’t think they regret it one bit. I view that rejection letter as their way of mocking me for even thinking that I could win a lottery for tourney tickets. I’d rather they just say “too bad…try again next year” than to express any faux sympathy for my plight as one of the unwashed masses.

        • DrLefty

          Reminds me of a college rejection letter a friend of mine got some years ago: “You have been de-selected for…”

  • Foothills A-rye-o

    If you were get the measure of guys like Larry Baer and Bobby Evans from print, TV, radio, or in person, would you suspect they are more likely to be in charge of a top team or a bottom team?

    • DrLefty

      Larry Baer was the top dog in 2012 and 2014. Evans is the new addition. Or in a different job, anyway.

      Sabean is a passionate, edgy guy. Evans talks like a CPA (no disrespect meant to CPAs). It’s not surprising he’d gravitate to quiet, boring guys more than edgy, flamboyant personalities. But I can see what Rosenthal (and Evans) are saying about needing a mix. “We miss Angel Pagan even though nobody liked him”–that’s a funny observation that has some good insightful nuggets of truth to it.

      • Keep’n It Real

        I would LOVE to know the background dynamics before I throw Evans under the bus; although the bus engine is running.

        • DrLefty

          The article speaks of “high-character guys.” That’s certainly not a bad thing. But Evans is a very devout Christian, and it’s not surprising that he’d feel most comfortable with players who reflect his values–what’s the old saying “I don’t swear or smoke or chew and I don’t run with girls who do”? Something like that.

          Sabean, in contrast, is on the second (much younger) Mrs. Sabean and seems like someone with more rough edges.

          Plus you add Sabean’s well-respected chops as a scout, which I don’t think Evans has. The combination of personality + expertise may have just been stronger in the case of Sabean.

  • Wow. Missed Tebow by one day. Would of been a daisy in a field of thorns to have Tebow make his debut at AT&T. He’s no Bo Jackson, but two sport guys in this day and age are pretty cool.

    • Matthew

      Especially ones that will look like Warren Sapp trying to ice skate in the Olympics

    • totalfan62

      Mets promoted him from low-A to high-A. I don’t think Tebow will ever play in AAA, let alone MLB. Nice story, sells some tickets, but that’s about it.

  • Surf Maui

    This looks like a bottomless pit. Its Dante’s inferno. But as I say everyday– this is the day that the win streak starts

    • Hoona

      I agree, I think the team finally shows some edge tonight

      • I want a sip of what you are drinking.

        • Hoona

          Nowhere to go but up from here.
          Why beat on a dead horse at this point? We all know they’re a bad team this year.

          • Sgbssfg

            Much like the way one should approach to child rearing, they are a team that has played badly.

        • 610nm

          Probably the entire pitcher.

  • Keep’n It Real

    If the Rays get Hechavarria, has anyone heard what their plans for Duffy are? I know he’s on 60 Day DL, but just curious if anyone has seen anything.

    • DrLefty

      Swap him back for Moore!

      • Surf Maui

        Yes– break the Duffy Curse ™

  • earlytimes

    With the 100 losses, there will be a 100 cockeyed theories as to what the hell went wrong and how to fix it.

    • 100 losses = 742 excuses, theories, conspiracies, calculations and condolences.

      • earlytimes

        Loss of Skeeter cost them at least 20 games. 😉

    • DrLefty

      Yep. The Rosenthal article definitely shows that building a team that will gel is not an exact science.

  • earlytimes

    They should start at the top. At least examine the Evans promotion to GM and Sabean focusing more on scouting thing. That has obviously not helped. The minors are a mess and the guys they brought in this year were all busts. That’s an area they were successful in the past with guys picked up off the scrap heap.

    We know Sabean and Baer retain approval/veto power but how much did they use it? If they gave Bob free reign so as to not be seen as meddlers or usurping his power, that will probably or should change.

    • DrLefty

      The big decision was to throw the big bucks at Melancon. I’m sure they felt the fan base demanded it after the disaster of Casilla et al last year. Having done that, they felt they were done spending–no Dexter Fowler or Ian Desmond or whoever else to bolster the outfield, and the dumpster dives were even further at the bottom of the dumpster. Really the only guy they spent money on was Nick Hundley.

      • Eric Ritz

        It’s been reported within the industry that Melancon to the Giants was the most sure thing of the offseason. Giants have a bad habit of wanting one specific guy, which tanks their bargaining. Bochy wanted Melancon, “Evans” went out and got Melancon. So Evans had to get the closer that was wanted, while also knowing he couldn’t break luxury tax. Signing the guy they wanted meant they couldn’t sign much else. It’s…a stupid plan.

      • The Oracle

        I believe Adam Duvall was the main reason they didn’t look for a free agent solution to LF. They absolutely did not want to be burned again.

        • Matthew

          I don’t follow that…they traded Duvall and got burned. Why wouldn’t they go sign Fowler or Desmond based on Duvall? To me, they just went over budget on closer and tried to go cheap in LF

          • This

          • The Oracle

            Because they didn’t want to be similarly burned by Parker and/or Williamson succeeding elsewhere, although neither of those two had the minor league numbers Duvall had.

          • Matthew

            Ahhh…yeah, I guess maybe. They seem like a British dignitary trying to drive themselves for the first time…in a clutch. This organization must be beginning to panic.

  • Michael Scott

    Lest you think that body snatchers have taken over me in the night- I haven’t given up. If it’s 39 games down- 40 games to go, we’re still in this thing.Just a break or 2 and we can do it.Well,a little cooperation will be required. Maybe a 39 game suspension for the rest of the division?.So get on board- we’re going places.

  • DrLefty

    We were talking below about the much-maligned Angel Pagan. This made me do a little research.

    The 2016 Giants outfield was nothing to write home about. But it stacked up like this:

    Pence: 1.9 WAR
    Span: 1.0 WAR
    Pagan: 1.0 WAR

    There were also backups during injuries, such as Blanco (-1.0, bad year) but Blanco’s numbers were somewhat balanced by a combined .6 WAR combined from Parker and Williamson, in part-time play.

    Contrast to this year so far. Pagan is Pa-Gone. Span is -0.6 WAR. Pence is -0.5 WAR. I don’t have time to look up all 12 guys who’ve played left field this year, but I”m gonna go out on a limb and say their combined WAR is in negative numbers. Gorkys Hernandez, the primary backup all year, is at -1.2 WAR, despite his recent “hot streak.”

    So they’ve gone from weak/mediocre to flat-out terrible. Does that mean they should have brought back Pagan and/or Blanco? Maybe not, but they should at least have done more to backfill the spots they left.

    • I bring both back. The knew what their respective flaws were and both players attempted to maximize their respective strengths. Both KNEW what the then Giant Way was.

      • paul in p.v.

        Pagan drove me nuts – but he also drove in some runs. Gregor still walks on water, in my books Clutch.

    • Michael Scott

      Span is plus 09. WAR as per Fangraphs,

    • Bleacher Bob

      Keeps reminding me of when the 49ers knew they were 1 guy away and drafted Dexter Carter. The veterans on this team have a lot of games in them. Maybe 29 is the new 35 with PED testing. This team looks old and plays old. The team chemistry feels stuffy and dull. They need a little Uribe.

    • Michael Scott

      SSS, but Gorkys HAS been hot this month- by any standard.

      • John Myhill

        True, but on the other hand, he sucks.

    • Noce

      According to FanGraphs Giants are -.7 WAR in LF overall. -23.7 Off and -7.1 Def. Overall last place.

    • Eleuthero

      Pagan has been much maligned on this blog but many forget that he was instrumental in our 2012 success. He hit .288 and, more importantly, wasn’t dogged by injury problems that dogged him in the 4 years thereafter. He’s another example of a targeted acquisition (like Scoots and Pence) without which we probably wouldn’t have won it all. He was definitely a hot dog and not much liked in the clubhouse either but the man could play ball.

      • Efrain

        Nothing wrong with hot dogs, would definitely give this milk toast team much more personality.

        I like mine with ketchup and onions.

        • Foothills A-rye-o

          Milquetoast

    • Noce
      • Michael Scott

        The OF ratings are mostly weighted down by the prior LFers. The regulars in RF and CF are .09 Span, .02 Pence. Slater is .05.

    • John Myhill

      It would have made sense not to bring pagan back if it had been clear from the beginning that young players would compete for the starting lf position. It made no sense not to bring him back if the team was going to spend half a season dumpster diving with veterans who aren’t as good as pagan.

    • Efrain

      that has always been the argument. I never had an issue moving from Pagan and Blanco because the team needed to get younger and more athletic a couple of years ago.

      The issue was how they went about it. with no obvious plan in place, no attempt to bring in viable solutions.

      Why? Do you really think the brain trust of the team really thought that guys like Mac and Parker were real answers. Two guys a few years from 30 yrs old already? They were not is the answer. Not then, not now.

      • Peter Johnson

        21 at bats by Parker this year, 31 by Williamson, but it was them that ruined the season .

        • Efrain

          the Giants and MLB know what those two can do. It’s no mystery.

      • DrLefty

        No, I think they were being cheap.

    • Eleuthero

      Interesting article. Football is a game in crisis with the cat out of the bag about chronic traumatic encephalopathy. Maybe a helmet cover that reduces impact by 33% will extend the long term viability of the sport. As things stand now, expect the pool of young football players to go into steep decline.

  • gamervixen

    It is all just vomit.

  • Bleacher Bob

    Is BamBam manager material? I want a spanish speaking mgr next time. And is Theo really that good? This FO needs lots of new blood. Love Wotus but he is more of the same.

    • John Myhill

      What’s point in having a spanish speaking manager if they don’t have any spanish speaking players?

  • The Oracle

    The Supreme Court unanimously stood up for the law today, as it should, no matter whose viewpoint it benefits.

    • Crickets …

    • Michael Scott

      A partial and hollow victory for Donald, that does nothing to stem the real threats- people who became radicalized in the U.S,

  • Proof Positive that Angel Hernandez has never had a clue. #NicknamedFlipACoin

    http://www.closecallsports.com/2017/06/review-blooper-getting-it-right-to-get.html

  • Bleacher Bob