by
Greek Giant
Todays Game: Giants (33-50) VS Pirates (37-46) at Roberto Clemente Park, 1:35 PM
Jeff Samardzija (3-9, 4.63) Vs Trevor Williams (3-3, 4.82)
The Giants are trying to complete their second straight sweep.
Five Questions
- Who is the greatest Giants catcher of all time?
- Who will have a lower ERA, George Kontos or Hunter Strickland?
- Which Giants pitcher will homer next?
- Who is the Giants’ best clutch hitter?
- Is Jeff Smardzija emerging as a top flight pitcher?
Breckeroni gave me his notes on Bochy’s pre-game show on the radio:
— Jones has a sore hand after getting HBP yeserday, “maybe” able to PH today, should be back on Tuesday in Detroit
— Bochy loved Hwang’s PH AB yesterday against a tough pitcher; said that if you can pull the ball in this league, you can do some damage
— Nunez back on Tuesday, they’ll have to make a roster move then, they’re not sure what though
Hit the ball to rightfield
Who’s the Tanner Roark wannabe pitching for the Bucs?
Needs to gain at least 30 LBS , to be a Tanner Roark look a like .
Righty, #57, Beard…
3 outta 4, Peter
#1 Is that a trick question, Mark Hill, ha, ha ,ha, Posey #2 Strickland #3 Moore #4 this year, Slater # 5 No, gives up to many HRs , throws to many strikes, hitters too comfortable
how about an ump that calls balls and strikes correctly for a change?
Watson?
if these clowns keep straying from the official zone, then that’s where we’re headed.
We don’t mind if the bad calls benefit the Giants. ; ) I saw the replay of Strickland’s K yesterday with the bases loaded to end the 9th and it may have been a little inside…. nice frame job by Posey though. Almost made up for the Belt out call at 2nd. That was a BS call, his left foot came off the bag because he was starting his stride back to 1st base with his right foot .
1. I can’t wait for TO’s input to the clear answer: The Pope From Leesburg
2. Strickland
3. Bumgarner
4. It can change every day.
5. Yes. With half decent defense, he be in the low 3’s along with his amazing BB/SO numbers. Dude has stuff
Who is the greatest Giants catcher of all time? i guess it has to be Buster, Nice dog. Hope he keeps him hydrated
Who will have a lower ERA, George Kontos or Hunter Strickland? Which one is better?
Which Giants pitcher will homer next? Bum
Who is the Giants’ best clutch hitter? If there was such a creature, I’d guess it might be Span- .385 with RISP. 381 with RISP 2 outs. just a guess,
Is Jeff Smardzija emerging as a top flight pitcher? Again?
Best season ever by a Giants Catcher ? 1946 Walker Cooper, .305, 35 HRs, 122 RBI .
Sweet swing, strong arm, called a great game.
nice find
Power historian, any MLB player that has ever hit 30 or more HRs , I know him, lots of hours reading Baseball stat books, Baseball cards .
1. Posey
2. Strickland
3. Bumgarner
4. Posey
5. Yes
Mr Scott has actual facts for #4, Posey’s numbers in clutch at bats this year are bad, he improved his average with RISP yesterday and was 1 for 4 with RISP yesterday .
I ignored the stats. I asked myself who would I want today in a clutch situation?
Also question is best clutch hitter, not best clutch hitter in the aberration that is 2017.
Wow, just wow !
Who would you want batting today in the 9th with runners on 2nd and 3rd and 2 outs and the Giants behind by one run?
Hwang?
My answer is Posey today, or Joe Baseball, or then Span or Slater, but I have been thinking that in a month’s time, Hwang just might be a valid answer.
Since I have no data to back me up, I feel I can speculate freely.
TWG is better when it goes data-free!
agree w/hwang. he’s going to be a good one
Not Posey , if nobody was on base Posey is your man , this year , the numbers say so, Posey is hitting .174 with 2 outs and RISP this year .
In the less than rigorous baseball parlance Posey is “due” and bound to regress towards a more normal stat reflecting his career.
The Giants appear to have lost their season long malaise the past week.
You didn”t answer the question. What Giant would you want to be batting in that situation today?
The hot hitters, Span , Panik, Slater, they are hot recently, Posey actually has lowered his average the last couple of weeks .
Reasonable choices.
The strike zone, and how good are umpires, despite all the complaints. The Brooks link is to a compendium of strike zone performance in games retrospectively.
http://www.brooksbaseball.net/pfxVB/zoneTrack.php
https://i.imgur.com/AYJ0ao8.png
Dick Dietz?
No wrong answer, Dietz did not play long enough for me though, Posey has .
4. there is no such thing
BS
WHATever
You against RBI stat too, one of these WAR fans .
There you go again….the concept of “clutch hitter” has been disproven. Go find it cuz I’m not going to spend a second doing it for you.
You are wrong, and I will not waste another second wasting my time with you, History of me following MLB has proven to me that some players are great clutch hitters, usually the ones with lots of RBI, some of them are .250 hitters , but get 100 RBI year in and year out .
Selective hitters who make contact and have power.
Think Pujols. Jeff Kent was a ggod clutch hitter for the Giants.
That’s purely anecdotal and statistically not correct as is the concept itself.
Smart guy !
Great clutch hitter. When your 2B gives you 100+ RBIs for six consecutive years, that defines clutch.
Live in your world. Your “history” is such BS and has proven nothing except to you.
Blocking…enjoying…
Good you have no Webos !
What’s a webos?
They wobble but don’t fall down.
My Spanish spelling is bad, Balls, I do not believe in blocking anybody except in Football, I also answer my phone, and do not wait to know who is calling, not afraid to say no thanks to people selling things over the phone, people now a days scared of confrontation for some reason .
Huevos
Ooops Old spelling
Huevos. Eggs. Balls.
Made a mistake the other day of supplying my real cell number while registering online for something. The next day I had spam calls all day. I think picking up would spawn more calls. I hate confrontation. But I wasn’t the oldest brother, I was the youngest.
I was the 2nd youngest of 15, my younger brother past away , so am the youngest living sibling in my family .
Thanks for the tip. Done.
Good , go through your live living in a plastic bubble, scared of disagreement , what a life !
Hunter Ozuna!!!
Pence looks like he’s back.
Fine play by Pence.
Sticking out the tongue again
A fine play by Belt. Atta babe.
Finally got it down Belt.
when you’re hitting .228, why not
It’s like a great shooting guard whose shots aren’t falling, so he gets to the free throw line. Get that average over .250 people will stop saying you aren’t contributing.
It’s funny that you mention that because Belt is in some ways pretty similar to Warriors SG Klay Thompson
Sounds like someone I know.
i still can’t get over buster’s play on cutch yesterday..
1) Posey.
2) Kontos
3) Shark
4) Posey. Not previously this season, but for right now and going forward he’s the guy I wanna see in the box.
5) As defined by this season’s metrics he’s top 20 in the NL right now. Follow up to above, he’s the guy on the bump who gives us the best chance to win.
OF is starting to round back into form. Slater has been a big part of that improvement
Atta babe Slater.
left field is no longer a concern
What a shock.
Slappy Moroff
Pittsburghs KT version.
Posey did the walk-off before the ump gave the call on that strike 3 (I’m radio-only today but that’s what Flem said).
Posey was literally 9 feet away from the plate by the time the ump made the call. Savage.
Yeah, baby. The Cubs are eyeing Denard Span. The Schwarber-as-leadoff experiment didn’t work, and they miss Dexter Fowler. Apparently they considered signing Span back when the Giants got him.
It would be so great if Span’s resurgence at the plate meant the Giants could get out from under the third year of his deal. They could sign or trade for a real CF, or maybe Duggar, Slater, or Reynolds would serve.
http://chicagocubsonline.com/archives/2017/07/cubs-reportedly-showing-interest-denard-span.php
Trade for a GM. The Cubs FO is loaded.
Ian Happ. I got a *real* good feeling about that kid.
It would be a win-win-win. The Cubs get something they need now, Span gets to be on a winning team, and the Giants free up payroll and get a chance to go younger in the outfield.
Span for Schwarber?
LOL, I wish.
I think Schwarber loses the baby fat, puts on man muscle, and becomes a great player.
Esa, nena. (Yeah, baby.) ;o)
Watch Kelby get crunched when Nunez is ready, and I’m kinda OK with that. Really like the kid, but I want to see what Hwang and/or Jones can do, at least until the ASB.
Looks like Jones may be out a few days and may need to go on the DL. Even when Nunez is back, they need someone who can play SS and 2B to back up Craw and Panik.
100% agree. Even without the ding to Jones, they’d keep Hwang and KT.
The bench today is Hundley, Gorkys, Jones, and KT. That no longer feels like a wasteland. Still with the 13 pitchers, though.
Not too many options if Jones has to be DL’ed. I guess if Nunez is ready they just switch spots. But Arroyo’s injured and so is Gillaspie. The other guys in Sacramento on the 40 are Parker, Mac, and Calixte.
IMHO, they should leave Nunez on the DL until at least after the All-Star break. He keeps tweaking his hamstring, and I can’t believe 10-12 days is enough to get that right. Especially if they’re looking to trade him by the end of July.
That makes sense. Jones and Nunez out until ASB, Hwang and KT at 3B with good D backup for Crawnik (see what I did there?)
I would think we could get a majority of our announcers to show up for any one game. Having two of them off at once? Makes for dull radio. Man, do they have great contracts.
We’re so spoiled with these guys.
Soooo true. They have great contracts because they’ve earned them. But on a Sunday with chores, we suffer 🙂
And other than Flemming (and Javy), they’re not spring chickens. Miller, Krukow, and Kuiper are all well past 60. I’m not surprised they need breaks during the year, even without Krukow’s health situation.
Being one of them, I love those old guys! Big fan of Dave and Javi, too.
I’m guessing the contract extension Krukow signed before the season might be his last. Wonder if Javy would like the gig full-time in a few years or if he’d prefer to split it with Affeldt.
I think Miller might have a few off days written into his contract. Same thought process.
Yes, when he signed his most recent deal, I believe it specified 120 games per year.
I really dont know what it is. I assumed Miller just has better things to do in the summer or doesn’t like the travel. Flem has another employer, of course. So there are a LOT of games without the full staff. The job is not physically taxing, although Miller’s not in good shape either
I don’t know how old you are, but I’m in the latter half of my 50s, and I find that traveling takes more out of me with every five years that goes by. I would think the job would be pretty tiring over 162 games + spring training + postseason some years.
Kim probably beats this drum every night.
I’m 56 and disabled (spinal stenosis/arthritis), and just the Wednesday same-day trip to the game and back to Merced wore me out, and I was sore all over into Saturday! My 75-year-old friend, although very healthy and fit for a senior, swore it’d be her last trip, and it might be mine too! I did have a great time however, seeing my first AT&T Giants HRs in person! 🙂
PENCE!!
Wow!
Atta babe Pence. Great catch.
What did they feed Hunter on the plane to Pittsburgh? (I want some of that) He’s having a great series.
Might of cut back a bit on his coffee consumption.
Pence giveth and Pence taketh away.
Took the words right off my keypad. ;o)
1st one could’ve caught, yes, should’ve caught, no. 2nd one, great catch
Nice demonstration of the use of ‘ve instead of of for “have”.
thank you…i think
He’s looking for a song lyric
Absolutely a compliment.
i only type w/one finger, so i keep it brief w/ as many short cuts as possible
One finger typing seems to beat illiteracy, hands down.
Diction changes lives
Atta babe Joe P.
He’s so good. He really does make it look easy.
Geez, a couple of balls have really carried …. for the Pirates
Another solid AB by Hwang
hwang is going to be a good one
Trade thoughts:
–The Rangers are looking for help for their “struggling bullpen.” Wonder what they’d give us for Dyson? LOL
–The Yankees are one blown save short of their team total for ALL of 2016. Bullpen help needed there, too.
–The Nats obviously need bullpen help, too.
Melancon’s not going anywhere right now. But I could see a number of other guys getting shopped–Strickland, Law, Gearrin, Kontos. Maybe even Dyson.
Can’t overturn that. No concrete evidence
Won’t surprise me either way. You never know with these clowns.
I don’t think he tagged him — first baseman acted like he missed him.
Yeah. He knew he missed him. NY is biased against SF in the replay world.
No evidence at all that we were shown. And a surprise to the first baseman as well. Replay is a farce
horse shit
If the umpire, in position, is that bad, he should be replaced on the spot with a random fat guy in the stands
lol..gotta be a fat guy?
and blind.
Got to be able to put away 7-8 chili cheese hot dogs at one sitting too.
I’d like to see the shift outlawed with two simple rules:
At the time pitcher releases the ball;
1. SS and 3B must be positioned to the left of second base and 2B and 1B must be positioned to the right;
2. All infielders must be positioned within the border between the IF and OF.
Belt agrees.
Phooey. Bunt more.
Hit the ball in the air more .
He has this year — 15 HRs at the midpoint but lower average. Belt has been okay. He is not a star, but he has been decent. Crawford I guess gets a pass on this board — he hasn’t got a hit in a month.
Yeah, Crawford is having his worse hitting year since 2013, my point is not anti Belt, but anti groundball, I do not watch a game and say I hope that ground ball goes through, I want extra base hits, and ground balls not down the line are rarely extra base hits .
Grounder to second would be okay with this AB. get the run in and the runner at second to third.
Nothing more thrilling than a bunt.
But that would outlaw the 5th infielder which is rare but you see once in a blue moon. Can’t have that. Keep the shift. Learn to beat it.
I believe the official rules mandate only that there be a pitcher and a catcher? Somebody like CU will know if that is right. Probably it is indeed on the hitter to learn to use the whole field.
But I like TO’s thinking outside the box, as per usual.
Outlawing the shift has been discussed in baseball for the past couple of years, even by the commissioner.
Teams seem to outsmart themselves with the shifts!
I like that Manfred seems to open everything for review. Except Pete Rose.
Does Jaso still have those blonde dreadlocks?
They actually have a greenish cast. Either my TV or fungus.
I’m going with ‘fungus’.
The racist in me wants the Giants to have a lineup that looks more like these Bucs.
That would be the guilty liberal in you.
Proud liberal. I want more black and Latin players. My favorite players have always been black or Latin. I give my family credit for never telling me that Frank Robinson was black, or that it mattered.
I want the best players, regardless of what group they belong to.
That sounds good to me, because they’d automatically turn out to be pretty diverse.
The Giants have the fewest players of color this year in recent memory, and no one can really argue, considering their record, that they have “the best players.”
I don’t believe it’s racist at all, but it might be subconsciously cultural. Bobby Evans likes polite, quiet, white Christian boys from the South like himself. People tend to gravitate towards those most like them. Sabean’s an East Coast guy with rough edges, and I bet he has a bigger tent as to who he feels comfortable with.
I remember back in 2011 when Radunich was accusing the Giants of not having any “brothers” on the team.
Isn’t Sabean still the President — does anyone know if Evans has carte blanche in constructing the team?
Wouldn’t surprise me if “Shut up Bobby” is still heard up there.
2014 Giants: Arias, Pagan, Blanco, Arias, Sanchez, Perez, Adrianza, Petit, Machi, Casilla and Romo. So Bochy and Sabean developed these roster altering preferences since then? Come on. All of those guys are gone for reasons relating to age and performance, and nothing else.
Maybe it’s less about who they let go and more about who they choose to go get. Also, Sandoval was on the 2014 Giants. Evans took over in early 2015, right?
Evans has never taken over.
And you know that how? Did somebody on the PAL team give you inside info?
Free agent Johnny Cueto…trade target Eduardo Nunez…the great Gorkys Hernandez.
And, in closing, their first two picks this year were named Ramos and Gonzalez.
I’d like to see more black American players too but if you have more foreign players you will have less American players of any shade, can’t have it both ways. I’m in the minority on the blog, I’d prefer fewer foreign players and more American players.
I like Hwang — I can’t believe Hill was on the roster for so long.
Neither can Hwang.
i love this guy
And they were within days of losing him because…why, again?
your pal mr hill?
Time will tell, but I had a really good feeling about Hwang from spring training. I was half-surprised he didn’t make the team out of camp, and then they called up everyone else–Arroyo, Jones, Calixte, Kelby–and left him in Sacramento. Just makes me wonder (again) about their player evaluation abilities as an organization.
I was rooting for Hwang to be on the opening day roster too but when he got
sent to AAA I thought, “ok maybe he needs to adjust to hitting and
seeing pitchers before being called up.”
I was thinking how ridiculous guys like Hill was keeping a spot when more deserving players in AAA were being passed over. Now that Hwang is here, it looks like he’s playing with confidence and a “look what you missed out on in the early part of the season” attitude.
He looks like a keeper.
me too, doc. i made him my guy in AAA, and had him on the final roster in haak’s contest. there’s something about him, other than the way he plays. strikes me as a winner..
I can think of a few reasons that might not necessarily be strong justifications to us nor entirely on field, baseball production related. But better late than never.
Exactly
He had a bad stretch of bases on balls, ala Runzler
here we go
yep here we go.
Something tells me Hwang is going to have a big hit this inning
ownage is ownage.
Belt can go inside out oppo. He makes it look easy.
That was a nice-looking swing. Very balanced.
Bob!
Atta babe Craw.
I don’t think the fans are too happy with the pitching change.
HRs are fine. This is the baseball I love most.
Go yard Hwang!
Hell yeah BCraw!! That’s got to feel good
No. They did not get him.
But knowing NY, he’s out.
safe.
your welcome
Hill wouldn’t have had the speed to beat it out.
Nice.
What is the record for a single umpire being overturned in a game.
Hwang has some fire. I can’t wait for his first bat flip.
He had a bat “drop” which was pretty bad-ass too.
Meh I consider that a big hit mwahaha
Thanks, Slater.
Come on KT this is yor chance to be POTG
Atta babe KT.
Too bad June is over. Span would have gotten a hit then.
He got a HIT on 7/1
It was a joke, CU.
OMG Right over my French Italian Cranium
The scoring is not over.
The addition of Hwang, Slater and Jones (when he plays) have really lengthened the Giants batting order and Slater has great instincts in LF.
Kelby down two strikes found a pitch he could lift (even if it is a ball) and score the Texas speed burner Belt.
Crawford’s hit must have felt good. Kelby or Nunez will be taking a day at SS soon to give BC35 a breather.
shut down inning are extremely important. nice job cory
need to add on
With CG wearing his locks short, it has allowed him to conserve his energy. Next he will get the Marine buzz cut sported by The Oracle.
Seek help.
Marcus Thompson II “told me” – he told you to also do the same.
Bullpen ERA in this win streak has been 1.09. Definitely the number one reason Giants are on a roll currently
And like someone else said, the additions of the new players in the past few days have helped to lengthen the lineup.
No doubt
Slater has brought it for sure.
Nice play in the bottom of the 7th for out number one
Not to be a hater, but the Giants’ two best stretches of play this season have both come with Melancon on the DL.
“Not that there is anything wrong with that”….
Yeah, pretty ironic, ain’t it?
In a different world, Giants move Melancon and make Dyson the closer.
Can’t move a guy who’s expensive and not healthy, unfortunately. Baaaad combo.
They’ll wring every last dollar out of that investment.
That…is an interesting observation.
Joltin Joe Jr. Atta babe!
sweet swing indeed
This has been said already, but damn: Javier Lopez is a natural on the broadcast.
Extend the lead, please.
Belt for the RIB EYE – right here
You were wrong two RBI’s
Johnny Guitar Watson (among others) “If lovin You is Wrong, I don’t wanna be right”….
YES!!
Those were a couple of desultory ABs by Pence and Posey after a leadoff double.
Posey does that a few times a year, takes three straight strikes, I guess he was guessing (wrong).
Posey appears to be less aggressive this season with RISP.
C’mon, Bob. Pick your teammates up!
eff yeah!
GET OUT!!!!!!!
BELTED
That’s our boy BB9!!
That was crushed
Yippeeee!
Sparky to the rescue.
Ohhhh man, how about a glass of milk with that cookie? Thank you very nice.
SPAR KEY
That’s how you beat a shift !
Clutch hitting by Belt.
picked up pence n buster
Alright Belt, I gotta hand it to you. That HR was clutch.
He has seven RBIs in this series so far.
Theres that word again, but yeah.
Posey remains a selective hitter but has lost aggressiveness of his past as in he Ked on 3 pitches and did not swing.
Belt has stepped up his aggression (as has Span and Pence recently and Hwang and Slater are natural aggressive hitters as is Nunez)
The Oracle getting depressed during the most recent winning streak. Misses MLBSF
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/cfd8b731c7ba7b29ed80250415a9a05f16e83a8c03129fc2af00c4e5d9e28284.jpg
who pitches the 8th for SF?
Strick was shut down. Maybe Okert. Crick gives me the HeebeeJeebies
maybe gearrin stays in?
I stopped her today. I hit mute in time.
Atta babe Slater!!!!
Slater. Everyday. Done deal.
like i said, LF no longer a concern
When Nunez returns from the DL, what do you guys thinks happens? Keep this lineup as is, or rotate Slater, Hwang and Nunez?
Never… NEVER mess with a successful lineup.
I think it’s between Hwang and Jones. If they mess with Slater, then they truly have gone slap crazy mad.
Still wonder what they’ll do with Parker.
A really radical idea might involve having only 12 pitchers.
I think he’s in the doghouse with Mac. Either used as trade bait or if they still have him past July recall him in September for PH duties.
Different situation. He was their Opening Day left fielder and then was injured in the line of duty. Also, he doesn’t have options and Mac does. If they don’t activate him when his rehab period is up, they’ll have to DFA him.
My pipe dream: They actually manage to trade Span and then either Slater or Parker plays CF, with the other one in LF.
Takes Gorkys spot? Risky, but both Slater and Parker can play CF, Slater the better defender.
Better move is probably trade for someone else’s stuck in the middle MiLBer and see what you get. That could be Mac as well if Duggar and Reynolds are legit.
Hats off to you Gearrin.
why take him out? over managing?
3 straight LHB
Never mind. I guess Josh Bell is a Switch hitter
He is , and you never take out a Pitcher in a grove anyway !
I remember picking walnuts in my friend’s walnut grove, we always took handled pitchers with us. Made the walnut collecting much easier.
LOL
Hope it doesn’t bite Bochy back in the ass for this pitching change.
Just saw the 3 LHB in a row. NM
Three Leftys in a row. Cory got 5 outs. Okert’s command is better than Osich’s.
Wonder when Hurdle will pinch hit Cutch?
As soon as they get 2 on.
OUCH
Over Managing was correct, stay with a hot pitcher, Lefty , righty crap is overrated !
we agree
Bochy should have stuck with Gearrin.
Unless Cory gave it up,then he should have gone to Okert.
PJ – there have been times that Gearrin could not fall out of a boat and find water. He got five outs. Okert was the correct move. Gives some Ukking credit to Jaso.
No melt down, please.
First HR given up by Okert comes at a bad time. The DredLock Former A goes deep.
Jaso can hit. He always seems to put good swings on balls.
nice grab Sparky.
Atta babe BB9.
Being a wide receiver
Belt !! Trade stock rising!!
Trade rumors being terminated, IMHO. At least not mid-season.
Unless Yanks offer something really valuable.
Who’s name we shall not mention, but he is really really really tall.
Clint Frazier maybe, but that won’t happen. I think Belt and Crawford are weary of all the banging on them and are ready to play to their career stats.
Bill Neukom’s friend of a friend, of a friend, of a friend, of a friend, the one that told TO that Evans isn’t running the show, that Belt is here for all of 17.
great, great play, but sparky will never get mistaken for JR80, the GOAT. never
That was an excellent defensive play.
Baby Giraffe THAT, y’all!
Bastardo would be the ultimate relievers name if he never gave up a run – ever.
Does Slater have a cat?
Remember what happened to the last guy who had a cat? We got Matt Moore.
Yeah, so I’m hoping he doesn’t. Every time everyone gets excited about a rookie, I think, “well that’s just peachy, so we’re probably going to lose the guy to some mediocre pitcher with caterpillar eyebrows.”
Ouch, babe!
Not touching that line.
Some bat flips or bat drops please!
I don’t mess with the lineup when Nunez comes back. Just keep it the same.
Crawford may get the team day off tomorrow Plus one more
That doesn’t count. Although with a hit, finally, he may want a few more ABs.
You might not but Bochy will. As it should be.
Dyson in to pitch?
Hold on to your Knickers. Torture = Torture and nothing has changed.
1 2 3 inning coming up.
called it!
Sure did! Nice win.
Coulda been called a strike
javi is really good
Javi should think about doing audiobooks. I wouldn’t mind listening to him read books.
I was listening and thinking similar, very much enjoy him on there
If my best guy friend and my best friend’s boyfriend (both gingers) merged into one person, they would look exactly like Dyson. It’s creepy.
it’s creepy you’re thinking about it peachy.
Every time I look at Dyson, I can’t unsee it!
do either one of them own a cat?
Nope
Dyson did something weird with the ball yesterday that Buster gave him after striking out the third out. Buster flipped him the ball and Dyson chucked it on the ground towards the Giants dugout.
Awesome. I think his hunger is greater than most.
I was going to share this last week. At the Giants/Braves game we attended, it seemed that the players, coaches and umpires were going out of their way to toss baseballs to fans in the stands. Every third out, the last player with the ball threw it softly into the stands and the ump rolled out a new ball. Every “pitcher reject” ball? Bat boys tossed them into the first few rows.
As a coach you’ll appreciate this one: at the end of infield warm ups, the 1B *always* lobs the ball to his first base coach in the dugout. When 1B comes back into the dugout, that coach tosses him the same ball. It’s always been that way.
In the game I attended, every single time the ball went from Belt to Aguacil, directly into the hands of a kid behind the dugout. As an old 1B I found that very interesting.
TF62 – I think that is totally accurate except I – have known at the ML – level that after tossing the ball in to the dugout area – the firstbasemans job is to put another ball or new ball into his own mitt and place his mitt with the other three IF’s mitts.
Also have you and your buddies or anybody on here ever played Mound Ball. That is when between innings the plate Ump rolls a ball out to the vicinity of the mound. BEFORE it happens you and your friends sitting in your seats have called out. Mound – Grass or Dirt. You get three points if the ball comes to a roll on top of the Slab – Two points for the dirt and one point for the grass. Winner/Losers can figure out who buys. Keep a tally as long as you can.
I saw that yesterday and thought it was odd. I wonder if it’s a tradition or superstition that he has.
Our bullpen next year.
Strickland – 7th
Dyson – 8th
Melachon – 9th
Will be fantastic !
Strickland—>Smith.
gearrin?
Long relief? He’s been pretty good this week. Kontos is certainly in the mix, and Law might get straightened out. It kind of feels OK to think about dealing Melancon, after the Giants get another two weeks chance to evaluate Dyson.
I could use some long relief. And I want somebody to start giving me credit for not doing too much.
all of a sudden the pen doesn’t look so bad
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/459c47ff45903922dd608ca8744e1f369bd414cc70a0e384f71528c8f5d25524.png
Hopefully Smith will come back strong and be in the mix as well.
Seriously!!
Good Morning’
Good Afternoon
Good Night
Sweep! Sweet!
Atta babe Dyson!!!!!!!!!!
Nice game
Felt like a professional baseball organization took the field today.
Feels like Olden Times.
The Mouse Turd Era! 18 more straight wins to go!
sam i am
Posey is Dysons’ comfort level.
I like our new closer!
And another team is paying his salary! All but the veteran minimum, anyway. He has been solid. Big time.
Now we can get Melancon fully healthy for 2019 -)
Or trade him to the Yankees for their harem of players
You called it. You were far and away the most optimistic about this pick-up, and so far it’s been a nice one.
Hurdle was holding onto McCutchen for that 2-run blast. Backfired big time
SWEEP! Six in a row. Brandons with key hits. Excellent defensive game. #rallymouseturds
Mouse turds FTW
When the Giants hit well as a team, good things happen.
🐭 💩 🏆
Puhleese, I won’t even respond to IMs that have those things in them.
it’s so much easier to just text a rolling eyes emoji, than to type out that I’m rolling my eyes.
Also, you can do this: 👉🏼👌🏼 Or this: 🍆🚫
The New Walt Disney Kids Movie – “Pole Vaulting over Meeses Turds”
🙏🙏
I think Bochy finally has a starting lineup that scores runs consistently and the bullpen roles figured out
Wonder if The Oracle knows that Evans,not Sabean had Dyson on the radar? Actually Uber scout Steve Balboni and Pat Burrell were staked out at the Texas games (don’t tell TO)
Whoever is responsible, kudos BIG TIME.
Nice editing Amy!
This in a nutshell is why I love Belt.
https://twitter.com/lolknbr/status/881613319341092864
Belt has a droll sense of humor.
VERY droll https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHl_7WHZbzg
I just KNEW you were gonna put up the white legs Bob video! It’s a classic.
Droll – Word of the Day
What happened to Belts Blog this year. Some of the funniest stuff ever written.
Neither Brandon has done a blog post in months. Maybe the season’s too depressing to provide much inspiration. Now that I write regular blog posts, I get that.
That’s our Belt. Reminds me of my goofball nephew in so many ways. Love that kid, and BB9 too!
You notice Kuiper has been trying to change the company narrative re: Belt’s posture? Three games in a row now I’ve heard Kuip say things like “Belt gets a lot of unfair criticism for his posture” and throwing it to Javy to explain why it’s unfair.
It was interesting watching the guys in the studio, who’ve been skewering Belt for weeks, pivot sharply, though they did still bring up that maybe he’s increasing his trade value.
That totally cracked me up.
Javy Lopez cracks Belt up when he calls him Sparky.
it was fun watching the game w/you guys. almost like we were all in my living room..fun game
Make sure PJ isn’t still on the john.
Wonder how many players have dragged or pushed a bunt for a base hit and also hit a HR in the same game.
i bet mantle did it when he was young. lot’s of speed and power
Great Call!
Highlights http://m.mlb.com/video?game_pk=491333&partnerId=ed-11666208-55341579
Can the Padres beat LA just once please?
Pads up 1-0 so far…
Puig just robbed SD of their second run. Damn.
Damn Puig… Pads touching up Dodgers pitching early though. That’s gotta be a good sign
4-0.
The sliding catch in front of the dugout by Hwang with Buster and Marge also in hot pursuit was tremendous in of itself, but he also got up asap and got back into the field of play to check on the runners.
#HiIQ
The more I see of Hwang the more I like him. He’s a ballplayer.
Hwang, like Slater, bring good energy to the Giants.
At 29 yrs old – he’s primed with good baseball acumen and IQ. Seems very savvy. Mature body, even looks a tad thick but runs really well.
He’s a keeper? Sweet!!
With nothing better to do, I’m watching “The Courtmartial of Jackie Robinson” on a movie channel. Looks good.
This was easily my favorite game I’ve watched this season. It seemed to go quick, Samardzija has been an absolute joy to watch this year (I’m a total sucker for high K/low BB pitchers and he’s been an absolute freak), that great 3 run come back inning, a killer Pence catch one play after a somewhat misjudged play at the wall, that sliding catch by Hwang, that no doubter Belt HR, that ridiculous “Jerry Rice” catch (how about Belt leading MLB 1B in DRS and UZR!?), Dyson inducing the wimpiest contact possible and ending on a K. Just the best game to watch on a Sunday.
Post of the Day (bar none, no not William Floyd)
I didn’t even mention Slater’s diving catch, Panik’s effortless defense, Samardzija legging out an infield single, just the best game top to bottom.
Hwang’s hustle infield hit (called safe on review) that set up the three-run inning where they came from behind and took the lead.
Sounds like Belt had the perfect day. He actually bunted to beat the shift?
Bunt early to beat the shift (which did send the 3B to his normal spot the rest of the game), opposite field line drive single to put them on the board, a bat drop HR 2/3 up the right field stands (which was extra helpful since Okert allowed the Pirates to get to 3) and – no hyperbole – maybe his finest catch ever. I’d love to see the Statcast data on the catch, no clue how he even caught up to it that far into RF. But all season he’s been making those kinds of running plays, typically in foul ground near the stands though. Earlier in the game he picked a grounder 35′ off first in one of those “why was he even over there!?” plays. I think the eye test doesn’t do his defense favors, as he rarely dives, but he gets so many balls in that 3.5 hole that most just allow to be singles, and they look like singles.
A week ago, we were headed toward 100+ loss oblivion and 3 wins in a row looked like too much. This team is now playing with passion and focus. Samardzija walked no one. Dyson looking great again. Belt on an RBI tear. This is a different team.
So great that we got Shark the W. He’s earned a few of those.
Amen. He didn’t deserve 2-9 and he’s a lot better than 4-9. His ERA now is 4.5 and I suspect he’ll end the year at a flat 4.0.
He had an ERA over 6 and gave up 6 HRs in April – I suspect that he had a talk with Bochy- now he’s pitching well and not showing up his teammates. Good for him for turning it around.
He looked really, really happy when Kelby knocked in that go-ahead run.
Flemming and Javy were talking about how Samardzija has uniquely been victimized by poor defense this season, and the stats bear that out: He’s second in the NL after Kershaw in xFIP at 2.94, a full 1.5 points lower than his ERA. He’s also tied for second for the worst run support in the majors (tied with Moore and Cain!). So today he got some great defense behind him and enough runs, too.
Some insights on the Brandon Belt “passing the second base bag fiasco” yesterday.
http://www.closecallsports.com/2017/07/past-or-prior-deciding-when-runner-has.html
Looking at the SF Giants tweet below (or on the side on desktop I guess), the Giants are 6-1 since Bochy signed a fan’s toaster. Toaster Era in the bay??
Can a fielder with ball in his glove push a runners hand off the bag?
http://www.closecallsports.com/2017/07/unreviewable-pushed-runner-play-again.html#disqus_thread
No, but I’ve seen it missed many times
I dunno. Ask Kent Hrbek.
The link explains it
Sam Dyson, coming in for The Oracle, jogging out of the pen…
The Giants came in today with a 6 game lead on the 2018 Fifth Overall Pick, whoever that is. That’s solid. I don’t need to see the Giants have the worst or 2nd to worst record in the Bigs. As long as they are able to secure something along the lines of the 5th, 6th, 7th, or 8th pick in the next year’s that should be a nice bonus for the system. And so maybe Johnny Cueto doesn’t get traded and they get pick close to 30th for his signing elsewhere. It will be a supreme draft. The organization follows the lead of the honchos that have been saying: this is not a rebuild, we will reload.
So they reload with drafting and minor trades, and one big and $$$ FA; but they keep the core intact to win while they are still in their primes:
Span CF/LF
Panik 2B
Posey C/1B
JD Martinez LF
Belt 1B
Pence RF
Hwang 3B/IF
Crawford SS
Bench: Arroyo 3B/IF, Tomlinson IF/OF, Slater OF, Jones IF/Shaw OF/1B, Backup Catcher
Rotation: Bumgarner, Shark, Moore, Blach, Beede/FA
Bullpen: Melancon, Dyson, Strickland, Law, Osich, Okert, Smith, FA, etc…
AAA with ready guys such as Shaw and Jones bouncing up and down and Steve Duggar and Slade Heathcott, and I haven’t even mentioned Mac Williamson and Jarrett Parker until now. What of them? And what of JD Martinez bringing a big stick to the lineup?
Great than .500? A contender? Oracle?
I think Slater is there LF of the here and now and of the future.
The Oracle is out fighting crime in SJ. Weekend shift garners more dinero, (Where is ‘our’ Dinero) ?
I think Slater is too, but he can be the guy cover all spots and get plenty of at-bats especially if one of the 30+ guys goes on the DL. Think he can handle CF okay, so long as he’s swinging a stick?
If not Martinez, than Lorenzo Cain. That would be In It mode of operation, IMO. Get pros, get depth. Hope for the best.
I like the switch hitter with glacial speed from Vandy.
you love Vandy players. Explain Beede?
This Slater kid is looking like a ball-player.
He’s ambulance chasing in D.C.
I like JD Martinez too…
It will be interesting to see how he looks in the next couple of games for Detroit…
I like Slater too….and he could be playing everyday even with JD Martinez in left…
With Pence, Span and Martinez all needing a day off…
Slater could be like a Brock Holt of the Red Sox…
Just don’t know if he could cover CF ..
Doesn’t JD Martinez run like Bengie Molina towing a Bartolo Colon Rose Parade Float?
Great visual.
I suspect that the Giants won’t need to buy an outfielder. They may spend their money–which hopefully they’ll have some after a few key trades this month–on their rotation. If, as assumed, they trade Cueto and cut ties with Cain, they will have to rely on Blach and Beede without much backup in the minors.
The second half of this season is a good time to see if Osich and/or Okert can get it done. Will Smith will be back next season, but if the O-twins aren’t the answer, they may need to put a lefty reliever on their wish list.
I hear a lot of Beede chatter but not sure of him yet. He’s not on the 40, tho that doesn’t mean much. But shouldn’t he be lights out consistently in 3A? Wonder if he gets a look in September. But I don’t follow the RiverCats like you do so I’ll rely on the incoming data you provide. On a side note, until Slater really stinks it up, he’s proven he’s the everyday guy. It’s his job to lose. Sometimes your chance is a short order, and he’s wasted no time. Parker and Mac? Trade them, release them.
That roster and LU will put you in major trouble with the TWG Board of Directors
You are living in a dreamland for sure. how can we take your baseball acumen seriously were all you have done, even if you mention and FA, a roster full of Giants farmhands, knowing full well the odds of everyone making it are slim to none (and the fact the farm is bare because of drafting issue).
But forget all that right, throw common sense out the door.
https://mobile.twitter.com/SFGiants/status/881612622444888064
Toaster Era in the Bay?
Giants winning, Iggy is back, Thornton re signs/Marleau gone. What a week. What next?
Don’t forget Livingston and West are back too.
Yes… and perhaps a Trojan as the first external free agent signing to come. It doesn’t get any better than that from these parts.
Shaw went bombs away again for Sacramento. That’s 8 in less than 150 PAs. He now has 14 on the year in which he is also batting over .300 across AA and AAA. Not bad, not bad at all.
I see Matt Gage got the start for the River Cats. I must have missed him being promoted.
Was this his first year at AA? Think so, and very impressive if it was.
No, I think he pitched in AA all last year, too. I was surprised when he didn’t get promoted to AAA, but there used to be a logjam (Blackburn, Gregorio, etc.) in Sacramento. Now I hear they’re taking volunteers to start games for the River Cats!
Foots? PerSpeier??
Call him up
Where would he play?
#tradebelt
Call me a skeptic, but I can’t see Shaw having anywhere near the success of Belt in MLB. He’s young and should still obviously improve, but I don’t see his specific skills transferring very well at the moment. I’d love for that to not be the case.
Could be a 20-30 HR guy playing corner OF and 1b. Could have decent average but lower obp
If he plays a cromulent LF I’m more intrigued than if he’s just a 1B.
I call you a skeptic.
You are kidding, right?
If he picks avg up to 250, hits 28 hrs with. 360 obp. And wins a gold glove, I wonder what a team would give up for his contract, something like 4/70
He would be worth more here.
Shaw’s been playing exclusively LF since coming to Sacramento. Reportedly he’s a poor defensive 1B (he also throws RH) but a good-to-very-good OF.
Dump that chump!
Oh, wait…
By all means move him up as far as possible. He’s one of mine.
His best shot up here would be battling it out with Slater for LF.
He could get that shot and look like Ryder jones
Huh?
Eventually I like Shaw in LF and Slater in RF. Slater’s a good OF and has played all three positions. Shaw looked good in LF when I saw him a couple weeks ago.
That could happen
Sleeper Slater.
Whoa.
Awards time!!!
Normally KT would be in the thick of things, but I’ve given him the Life Time Achievement award so he will no longer be eligible for POTG honors.
Belt would be a solid choice but I’m giving co-POTG awards to Gearrin and Kontos- George didn’t pitch today but I would be remiss if I didn’t point out that they’ve quietly become our 2 best relievers. I will hold off on Dyson for now.
Finally, for his stellar work over the last week, Bochy gets the prestigious Smart Bro honor.
Pads up 5-2 on LA in 6th
Yep. It’d be a good day to gain a game on LA. Need to gain one game a week and beat them in the series meetings.
And gain ground on the WC standings as well
22 back!
Think of the history books!
Congrats to BP: the starting catcher for the NL team in this year’s All Star game. I think, though some people here would disagree 😉
Well deserved
Mr. Pajamas?
“Terrell Owens”?
I was thinking of Peter.
I just defended and backed you on the KT’s wife spat yesterday, and this is what I get from you, I always root and think Buster is great, but since he is great I expect more out of him, and his hitting in RBI situations has been awful this year . He deserves the NL All Star spot by far ,this year has been a bad year for NL catchers , besides him . Since you blocked me, you will never read this post anyway !
Rockies lose again, blowing a one run lead in the 9th. 10th loss in last 11 games. They are in absolute freefall right now. Their record now stands at 48-36.
I think the fans nailed it on NL starting lineup, especially since that’s exactly how I voted!
Thank goodness for Buster Posey, because on this team that loves to draft guys like Kelby and Duffy, he’s the only clear cut AS on the squad.
Mad Bum?
I wouldn’t sign him if he was FA. All those miles at his age AND a serious injury? No thanks.
So same with Kershaw, right? He was out 10 weeks last year with a serious injury, and it could crop up again any time. He’s older than MadBum and has even more miles. You wouldn’t sign Kershaw as a free agent?
as much as I love Kershaw probably not. Look at how people view the Grienke deal. Although he is better this year than last year, is he worth that much? And if Greinke can command that $$$ how much could Kershaw get? 300M? 350M?
no thanks.
Agreed. I think the Greinke deal was foolish and I wouldn’t sign Kershaw for huge bucks, either. As for MadBum, let’s wait and see. The Giants were smart with him. They had to pay Lincecum and Cain when they were 27. They won’t have to pay MadBum until he’s 29. As we saw with the other two guys, a lot can happen between 27-29.
And it was a waste of money wasn’t it? I kept saying TL was done 3 years before he retired. Just how much money did he bleed the team those three years, money that could have gone to much needed FA? How much better could that wasted roster slot have been utilized? Ergo my “Timmy syndrome” theory, that the 13 man pitching staff that became necessary for much of his last three seasons was his fault.
One can make a similar argument for Cain.
Cain’s contract has turned out worse than anything they paid Lincecum and even worse than Zito’s–and that’s saying something. Between his injuries and his ineffectiveness, they’ve gotten almost nothing out of that deal. And they still have to pay him $7.5 million next year to (probably) sit on his couch or be out on the golf course.
I hadn’t realized until today that they also have to pay Span $4 million in 2019 to buy out his option. These pricey options are ridiculous. I know the negotiations with Cain were pretty challenging at the time, but they had to guarantee Span an extra $4 mil at age 36?
The option is worked into the overall contract though. Span will cost 4 mil to cut, but he also only cost 5 mil last year. It’s just a way to divert funds to the future, where money is slightly “cheaper”.
The team makes money. They need to cut their losses and move on.
Keeping guys around because they are owed money is a bad move for a team trying to move forward. Those roster spots will be better utilized if they go to younger players that can contribute.
Shite-4-brains, as one brainiac pointed out at the time.
I was lamenting on that a couple weeks back, during my “Span, you really suck” period (never said those words, but the emotion was there). The marketplace buzz had Span getting at best one year and maybe an option on another. We give him three years, AND a half-year salary buyout?
Our Giants have always overpaid on free agents. Alfonzo, Durham, Roberts, Rowand, Renteria, Huff (second contract), FSanchez, Pagan, Scutaro, Lincecum and Cain quickly come to mind. Still, there’s those three rings, and we wouldn’t have any if them without some of those guys.
There was talk that the Nationals were considering offering him the QO though, which was 16 mil at the time. If they were even considering giving him the offer, it means they were expecting him to get a multiyear deal from someone.
35 Million his last 2 years, and 15 out of his 40 starts were 1 run allowed are less, not that bad, lots of worse contracts than that .
garbage
(you also gave me a bs stat because in those 15 starts how many times did he get out of the 5th inning? How was the pen? Were they tired?)
Hater!
you just hate I’m right WAYYYYYYY more often than you.
LOLZ
No Timmy was never garbage, very inconsistent yes, he had great starts are bad starts, 2.08 ERA after 8 starts in 2015, 3.68 ERA at All star break in 2014, 19-13 record in those two years, Giants a winning record in his starts in his last 2 years, that is not Garbage, you Hater !
funny how you fail to post his record in the OTHER starts. Why don’t you tell us.
Even if you want to only mention the very small window of “good”, 35M for 19-13 over two years is pretty weak.
Let’s just say I wouldn’t put you in charge of the roster and finances.
LOLZ
He was injured for the last 3 and half months in 2015, so 19-13 for less than a year and a half, you wish Cain was even close to that the last 4 seasons .
i don’t since Cain has been as big a waste of time and money and roster slot.
Posey was the #5 pick in the draft. Kelby was 12th round and Duffy was 18th. Odd comparison.
Beat me to it.
Yeah the team should be going for better 12th and 18th round prospects. This comparison makes no sense.
do some research. Check what the Dodgers, Nats and Cardinals have been able to draft in similar slots as the Giants. All winning some division titles or coming close every season.
So why is the Giants farm so bad? The slot they draft in excuse is bs.
Seager was a first-round pick in a year the Dodgers picked before the Giants. Bellinger was a fourth-round pick like Crawford was. Crawford’s a two-time Gold Glover, a two-time World Series champion, and a former All-Star.
soon to be on the downslide of 30
As will all of them be in due time. You were making a point that the Giants draft poorly while the Dodgers draft great. I’m just pointing out that the comparisons don’t hold up well.
What have the Dodgers and Cardinals drafted in the 12th and 18th rounds? There’s no doubt their overall draft game has been stronger, but the initial comparison was wack.
Dude relax, it’s just been a down year and now that the Giants are finally in a winning groove, you’re going to bring this shit up again?
As depleted as the Giants farm was considered to be, Slater and Hwang are proving to be valuable commodities, Jones and Arroyo probably need more nurturing in the minors but they’ve shown flashes of their potential, and Shaw is absolutely raking right now. Not to mention Heliot Ramos and Jacob Gonzalez in Arizona rookie league, who look promising in their own right.
Give this thing time.
you just named 6 guys (I don’t count Hwang as he is not a draft pick.
Do you really think all 6 are going to “make it”? DO you know the odds of farmhands becoming every day major leaguers, much less starters?
Sure there one can be positive, but let’s be real. It’s not fantasy land.
All I can say in response to that is: Who knows?
Just be patient.
You should count Hwang, though. Even if he’s not a draft pick, the Giants have been justly criticized for not doing well on the international market. They went after Hwang and they got him, and now he’s on the big club. We’ll see how it goes.
I dig his spirit.
Me too. He plays like the game is not too big for him. That AB yesterday, where he pulled a double down the LF line was impressive.
Guilty pleasure admission: I can’t get enough of the Korean PBP call of Hwang’s HR. They knew it was gone right away, and the excitement and pride accelerated into a great call, even though you have no idea what they’re saying.
It’s worth mentioning that this six-game winning streak is on the backs of homegrown players–Posey, Panik, Crawford, Belt, Slater, Hwang, Jones, and Tomlinson (who drove in the winning run today). Everyone in the lineup except for Pence and Span is a product of the Giants’ system. Yeah, it’s just a week, but it’s the best week they’ve had all season. They’re actually playing like a quality major league team.
yet they are about a million games behind.
too little too late.
Yes, but several of those guys started the season in Sacramento. That’s not their fault. It’s on management. They thought Aaron Hill and Chris Marrero and Justin Ruggiano and Drew Stubbs were better choices.
I thought Ruggiano was a smart platoon signing 🙁
I can proudly say that the other three always felt like bad moves to me.
I liked it as a no-risk flyer when they signed him, but he did next to nothing here. I don’t mind signing guys to take a look during spring training. I do mind when they get playing time when they’re not producing, just because they’re veterans.
It’s Bochy’s trap. He never knows when they’re just flat out toast, or when he needs to “play them more to get ’em going”.
O.T.H.
You left Stubbs out of your desperado noun-string this morning. Gawd.
Jones may have potential, but I don’t know how you can say he’s flashed any of it.
Dominec Mazza, who pitched a perfect game earlier in 2017 A level Augusta, pitched a 9 inning complete game 2 hit shutout today with no BB.
Mazza is a 2015 round 22 pick from UC Santa Barbara.
http://www.milb.com/player/index.jsp?sid=milb&player_id=664935#/career/R/pitching/2017/ALL
It is a long way to MLB from Augusta.
As to everybody’s fave CFer, FanGraphs has zero’ed out his DRS numbers- those were insane, especially when compared with his UZR/150.I’ll be interested to see the new numbers
Good. Hopefully that will make him even more attractive to the Cubs. If they could trade Span this month, it will save them between $15-20 million over the life of his contract.
Fowler was never a guy with a very good DRS (last I checked this year it was -8, and I know he’s put up worse years). I don’t think that would stop them from getting Span.
I think they want a good leadoff man like Fowler was for them.
Well,we will see soon enough. The Cubs would be a nice landing spot for Denard, we would doing him a favor- he may get a ring there.
Yep. Could be a win-win for everyone.
His arm will play better in Wrigley too.
Give me an upvote. or else.
Arseloch. ;o)
Geez, I sure hope Denard doesn’t read this blog. He seems like a really nice gentleman.
It’s not personal. He seems like a great guy.
I regret not contributing more to this, my favorite, baseball blog. It’s been really hectic with my new book coming out! I never realized how much work it is publish a book and then promote it!
This is how I anticipated our Giants to play this season! It was unbelievable to see them get off to a historically awful first half. Hopefully MadBum will return soon and they can at least regain respectability.
In honor of today’s 54th anniversary of the classic pitching duel between Marichal & Spahn I’m posting a chapter excerpt from my book, Falling in Love With Baseball. If you like what you read here, please go to MavoBooks.com/shop or Amazon to buy it. Reviews of it have been great!
A Pitcher’s Duel for the Ages
This story began as an e-mail sent to family, friends and posted on a baseball blog a few days before the fiftieth anniversary of the 1963 Giants vs. Braves game. Journalist Andrew Baggarly posted the original version of this story on the CSNBA website.
This Tuesday, July 2, 2013, is the 50th anniversary of a remarkable historic base-ball game played in our own Candlestick Park. It was perhaps the best pitchers’ duel of the live ball era (which dates from 1920). I am, of course, referring to the magnificent duel between Warren Spahn of the Milwaukee Braves and Juan Marichal of the San Francisco Giants. Both hurlers in this pitching duel for the ages are Hall of Fame members. Undoubtedly, they both rank among the best pitchers in baseball history.
Let’s set the stage for this drama. The Giants were in their sixth season in San Francisco. They were defending NL champions and, had a line drive been a foot or two higher the previous October, would have been the defending World Champions. But that is a story for another day. The Giants were loaded with stars, especially sluggers, destined for the Hall of Fame. They were in the midst of a run of excellence that would see them win the most games in the NL for the decade of the 1960s.
The Milwaukee Braves were in their eleventh season in that city after they had fled Boston in 1953. They were two-time NL champions in the late ’50s and still were a force to be reckoned with in the NL that season of 1963. The Braves also had multiple stars destined for enshrinement in Cooperstown.
Both teams were some of the first, along with the Dodgers, to recognize and sign the deep talent pool of African American and Latin American players. As a result, they were perennial contenders for the pennant.
The two co–home run leaders for that season of 1963, Henry “Hank” Aaron and Willie “Stretch” McCovey, played in the game, both future Hall of Famers. Strangely, they tied with 44 home runs that season, the same as both their uniform numbers! Numerologists would have a field day with that one! Both of them hailed from Mobile, Alabama. In fact, Willie McCovey chose 44 as his uniform number when he broke in 1959 because it was his idol’s . . . Henry Aaron’s number! Of course, Henry Aaron would go on to break the most hallowed of all baseball records: Babe Ruth’s career home run total of 714 and wind up his career as the all-time home run leader with 755.
This game also featured the other two top home run leaders for the NL that year. That meant all four of the NL home run leaders played that night. The NL home run leaders were, in order: Aaron 44, McCovey 44, Mays 38, Cepeda 34. So the game did not lack for power hitters! The power-laden Giants, even in windy Candlestick, would lead the league in home runs that season by a large margin: 197 over the Braves at 139.
But the key actors in this drama that would make Shakespeare proud were Marichal, Spahn, and, in my opinion, the best ballplayer to ever lace up his spikes . . . Willie Mays!
The contrast between the two pitchers could not have been more stark. Marichal was a hard-throwing right-hander of twenty-five who was having his first great season. Spahn was a left-hander of forty-two who was having the last great year of a stellar career. Both would win over 20 that year (Marichal 25 and Spahn 23). Yet both would not get a single vote for the Cy Young Award because a lefty named Sandy Koufax was beginning the greatest four-year run of pitching dominance in baseball history.
When the Tuesday evening game started at eight p.m., Marichal came in with a record of 12–3 and Spahn was 11–3. Both pitchers featured a high leg kick in their delivery, but the similarity of these two pitchers ended there.
Spahn was the crafty old veteran left-hander who got by on wile and experience. Spahnie, as he was known, already had well over three hundred victories. And that was including him missing three whole years of his prime while fighting in World War Two. Spahn had thrown a three-hit shutout just four days prior at Dodger Stadium.
Marichal was a fire-balling right-hander with great control who had thrown a no-hitter only seventeen days prior. Marichal was, just that season, becoming the undisputed ace of the Giants staff.
Spahn had no-hit these same powerful Giants two years before on April 28, 1961, five days after his fortieth birthday. Incidentally, two days after that no-hitter tossed by Spahn, Willie Mays tied the single game home run record by clouting four in a game.
On a personal note, I quit a heated neighborhood ball game in the park to go home and listen to this game on KSFO. I knew it was going to be a good match-up, but I could not have imagined how historic it would be. So after a quick dinner, I hustled out to the living room where my dad had his large console stereo set, wood and all. It was about five feet long. I tuned in to Russ Hodges and Lon Simmons and lay down on the carpet to have the two large speakers by my head. Of course, I had my trusty glove with me and tossed an old beat-up ball in the air as I listened. I was ten years old and already totally in love with baseball. The game started as you’d expect; both pitchers looked in good form.
There was no real scoring threat through the first three innings. Marichal had only given up a single in the first. Spahn had also only given up a single to Orlando Cepeda in the second. Even though Cepeda stole second, he died at third when José Pagán, the Giants’ shortstop, fouled out.
In the fourth, the Braves mounted a rally off Marichal. After Marichal retired the two Braves’ Hall of Fame sluggers, Hank Aaron and Eddie Mathews, he walked Norm Larker, the Braves’ first baseman. Mack Jones, a slugger in his own right, hit a single to get on and Larker moved to second. Here, one of our trio of heroes made his first big contribution. Del Crandall, the Braves’ fine catcher, lined a single to center. Willie Mays, the finest center fielder in history, fielded it and gunned down Larker at the plate as he tried to score from second! The score was still 0–0 headed to the bottom of the fourth.
Eddie Mathews left the game starting the bottom of the fourth due to injury. Denis Menke, a fine young utility player, replaced him in the cleanup spot. The Giants managed a single by McCovey in the bottom of that inning, but Spahn did not let him get past first as he set down the Giants, 0–0 going to the fifth.
The next scare came in the top of the seventh. The Braves’ Crandall led off with a single. The Braves had stolen two bases in the two previous innings, but Marichal pitched out of it. Now, with Crandall on first and the bottom of the Braves order up, he tried to steal second, also. Ed Bailey gunned him down for out number one. Then with two down, Warren Spahn, who was a fine hitting pitcher who hit 35 home runs in his career, doubled. He was stranded at second, though, when Marichal got Lee Maye on a grounder to first. It was still 0–0 going to the bottom of the seventh, and both pitchers still looked strong. In this era of no pitch counts, neither manager remotely considered taking out his ace!
The Giants scratched out two singles against Spahn in the bottom of the seventh. But they came with two outs and both runners were stranded when pinch hitter Jimmy Davenport flew out to end the inning. Still 0–0, and the tension was building heading to the eighth inning.
It was about this time I started realizing how lucky I was that it was a summer night with no school. It was past ten p.m., and if it had been a school night, I’d have had to break out my old trusty trick. I kept a transistor radio (yes, kids, we called them that back then!), stashed away in my bedroom in a secret hiding spot. When I had to go to bed during a Giants game, I’d put that radio under my pillow and listen until I fell asleep or the Giants won. I suspect my mom knew my secret, as at times the radio was sticking out from under the pillow when she came to wake me in the morning. But, being the gold standard of moms, she never said a word. God bless her!
The game headed to the eighth inning, and both pitchers kept dealing blanks. After the scare in the seventh, surprisingly Marichal gained strength. With one out in the eighth, he walked Henry Aaron, probably not a bad thing to do. Then he retired the next sixteen Braves batters in a row! Who knows what his pitch count was, but the young ace was really dealing now. He finally yielded a harmless single with two outs in the top of the thirteenth but retired the next batter to close out the inning.
The game almost had ended in the bottom of the ninth. Mays led off by hitting a line drive off Spahn, only to have the shortstop throw him out at first. The other Giants Hall of Famer, Willie McCovey, hit a high drive right over the right field foul pole. My favorite umpire (because his name was Chris and he was Greek), Chris Pelekoudas, umping first base, called it foul! Most Giants, including McCovey, thought it was fair. After a heated argument, Stretch bounced out to first. Felipe Alou singled, but Cepeda popped out to third and we were headed for extra innings.
Juan was humming now, setting the Braves down inning after inning. The only problem for the Giants and us faithful fans, both at the game and at home listening, was that the old man, Spahn, was also keeping the Giants scoreless. So as we entered the bottom of the thirteenth, it was still 0–0!
Giants’ manager Alvin Dark approached Marichal when he came off the mound after the top of the thirteenth and asked him how he felt. Juan looked out to where Spahn was warming up to pitch the thirteenth inning and broke baseball protocol by telling his manager, “See that old guy out there? He’s forty-two! I am not coming out of this game until he does or we win!” With that, Dark shrugged his shoulders and walked away. Marichal admitted after the game that his shoulder was getting stiff in the chill of a typically frigid Candlestick night.
In the bottom of the thirteenth, Spahn gave up a leadoff single to Ernie Bowman, the Giants’ light-hitting utility infielder, who had come in for José Pagán at shortstop when Davenport pinch hit for him in the seventh. Finally, a threat! Bowman had speed and was frequently used as a pinch runner. I got excited. Not so fast! Spahn, the wily veteran, promptly picked Bowman off first when he got too big a lead. The next two went down and we were going to the fourteenth in a scoreless tie!
About this time, my dad came in from the garage and asked if the game was still on. I explained the amazing drama unfolding, and he sat down to listen too. It was after eleven p.m. now. A classic was unfolding at The Stick.
Marichal navigated the top of the fourteenth, giving up only his fourth walk. In the bottom of the fourteenth, I thought for sure the Giants would win it. We had Mays and McCovey hitting second and third, with Harvey Kuenn, a former AL batting champion, leading off. Both my dad and I got excited when ol’ Harvey, who wound up his career with a .303 batting average, led off with a classic Candlestick windblown double that fell into right field.
This surely was it, the ageless pitcher had to be tiring and we had our version of Murderers’ Row coming up, starting with Mays. Spahn, who Mays had hit more home runs off of than any other pitcher, wisely walked Willie intentionally. But now he had to face the fearsome Willie McCovey, who you might remember had almost won it in the ninth and tied for the home run lead that year with Henry Aaron. I thought for sure the Braves would bring in a relief pitcher. But Bobby Bragan, the Braves manager, probably decided to let his old ace win or lose it on his own.
I was only slightly disappointed when Stretch McCovey fouled out to the catcher. We still had Felipe Alou, a dangerous hitter, and Orlando Cepeda, the Baby Bull, coming up. I was still optimistic. These were two tough right-handed hitters. Both were All-Stars and Cepeda was a future Hall of Famer too. Surely, one of them would win this marathon off the tiring old man on the mound.
But Felipe flied out to shallow center field and both Kuenn and Mays had to hold at second and first. The dangerous Orlando Cepeda was up. Would they dare walk him to load the bases? No! Spahn pitched to Cepeda! He got him to hit a grounder to third, and Menke, who had replaced Eddie Mathews, booted it. Bases loaded now with two outs! Ed Bailey, our powerful catcher, was up now. But he flied out to center field. The crafty old veteran lefty pitched out of it . . . again! How long could this go on?
Marichal set the Braves down again in order in the top of the fifteenth. During the inning, Warren Spahn batted for himself! Talk about old-school baseball! When Marichal came into the dugout after the fifteenth, he noticed Dark had a pitcher warming up in the bullpen. If the Giants could not win it this inning, Juan was probably coming out . . . before the old man!
Spahn, amazingly at this stage, quickly set down the Giants in order in the bottom of the fifteenth. Marichal batted for himself and made the last out by striking out. He was staying in for the sixteenth.
Juan set the Braves down again in the top of the sixteenth, stranding Menke, who had singled with two down. As he left the mound, he waited near first base. Willie Mays for years had the habit of always stepping on first base as he trotted in from center field at the end of an inning. This time Marichal was there waiting. He said to Willie, “Alvin is going to take me out before the old man.” Willie just looked at him and said, “Don’t worry, I’ll end it this inning for you!”
Harvey Kuenn led off the bottom of the inning by flying out to center. I have always wondered this, as Willie Mays dug himself into the batter’s box to face Warren Spahn, did he think back to his first home run as a major league player over twelve years before? He’d hit it off none other than the veteran lefty he was about to face now, Spahnie. Willie already had 381 home runs on his odometer and wound up in his career hitting more home runs off Warren Spahn than any other pitcher . . . eighteen! Spahn had to know he was in deep trouble as Mays stood in to face him. But he could not walk the speedy Mays and risk a stolen base. Besides the fearsome HR co-champ that year lurked on deck . . . McCovey.
And so the classic pitchers’ duel of the twentieth century finally ended dramatically and suddenly when Mays laced one of Spahn’s offerings far over the left field fence and trotted around the bases, as he did 659 other times in his illustrious career. It was simply called a game-winning home run in those long-ago days. It was not until the 1980s that the term “walk-off” came into use. As Willie slowly circled the bases, the old lefty trudged to the locker room. It was over! My dad and I could finally go to bed . . . happy!
We will never see another pitchers’ duel like this marathon contest with the starting pitchers going all sixteen innings. With today’s emphasis on protecting pitching arms, not to mention protecting multimillion-dollar investments, managers start considering going to the bullpen when a pitcher approaches 90 pitches. Marichal threw 227 and Spahn threw 201 pitches that chilly night at The Stick!
Amazingly, exactly thirty years before, on July 2, 1933, another Giants Hall of Fame pitcher, the great screwball wizard Carl Hubbell, threw an eighteen-inning shutout against the St. Louis Cardinals at the Polo Grounds. He also won 1–0. I rate the Marichal vs. Spahn duel superior because the “candy-ass” Cardinal starting pitcher, Tex Carleton, didn’t complete the game and needed relief help after sixteen frames. This was the Cardinal team that would be known a year later as the Gashouse Gang and had many of the same stars.
King Carl Hubbell, as he was known, was probably in attendance the night of the Marichal vs. Spahn duel. He was the Giants’ director of the farm system at that time. In 1933 he was 23–12 with a microscopic ERA of 1.66 and won the first of two MVP awards. The Giants won their fourth World Series that year over the Washington Senators in five games. Hubbell won two games and didn’t give up an earned run. King Carl he most certainly was!
So, this Tuesday night, July 2nd, if you’re a baseball fan, give a thought to how the old-timers played our beautiful game fifty years ago. The Marichal vs. Spahn marathon was, in my opinion, the greatest pitching duel of the twentieth century. When pitchers took the ball back then, they expected to finish what they started.
Thank you for sharing.
Sports phone 680 on KNBR should be called “Giants Phone 680”. I’d like to hear about Patty Marleau, but I guess people like talking about all star selections.
The Warriors Luxury tax is going to be close to 200 Million in 2019 if they try to keep core players together, no way they sign Nick Young, that increases the tax even more .
The first core player many writers see going first is Klay, but that is a few years away.
Yes after 2 more years, but KD is getting a Steph type contract next year, Luxury tax 50 Million for next year, then 100 Million, then 200 Million, then 400 Million if they keep Klay and Green .
I’m thrilled that Marleau is gone…addition by subtraction.
Patrick will go down as an amazing scorer. But, his wanton refusal to get tough in a tough sport, and his lack of effort on defense too regularly made him a one-way player with two-way talent.
If he played as hard as Jumbo, he could have been a Crosby…
I do wish him good luck. But I’m happy he’s gone
BS, Thorton was very bad, slow lots of turn overs, Marleau still fast , and can score .
You love home runs and goals, but don’t appreciate work. Thornton works. Marleau doesn’t. If Patrick ever worked as hard as Jumbo, he would have been twice as good as he was.
How many Marleau goals were tap ins from all the Thornton work? From Thornton assists?
Watched the games and Marlaeu still has it, Joe is done .
Gentleman’s bet. We’ll see about Marleau. My comments aren’t claiming Joe has much left. I’m fine with the 1-year for him. That has nothing to do with Patty being gone. Good riddance to a lazy selfish cherry picking scorer
Last year we did see Jumbo slow down but it may have alson been due to a short off season and playing in the World Cup. When he has the puck and slows the game down, he forces the opposition to play his game. He makes plays happen and did is a generational player: something we don’t see often in the Bay Area. Appreciate Jumbo when he can still lace them up.
I’ll admit Patty is one of the most polarizing Bay Area athletes we’ve seen. He was a solid goal scorer, but I have to disagree about your assessment about not going to the dirty areas assessment playing defense. He’d disappear sometimes and consistency wasn’t his strong characteristic, but when he was on, he played a 20 foot game. It’ll be weird to see him not wearing to teal.
The Sharks are the best team in the NHL not to win the Cup over the last dozen years. Throughout that period we’ve been to one Cup round and bowed out early countless times. Marleau and Thornton are both 38. It’s time to build a new team identity.
Agreed, but it sounds like Wilson will reload rather than rebuild.
I don’t know if it was because they didn’t a title, but division championships, numerous playoff appearances, and President’s Trophy don’t mean much to many in the Bay Area.
The Dodgers have assembled a good team as the Giants did when they were a good team: by having some drafts picks pay off well, combined with other good decisions;
Kershaw…7th pick of the 2006 draft (the same draft the Giants took Lincecum with the 10th pick);
Grandal…acquired in the Matt Kemp trade
Bellinger…4th round pick
Taylor…acquired in trade from Seattle for 1st round pick Zach Lee;
Seager…18th pick of the 2012 draft (the Giants took Stratton with #20);
Turner…free agent signing
Puig…international free agent;
Pederson…11th round pick;
Wood…acquired from the Braves in a three-way trade where they gave up 6 minor leaguers, none of whom has amounted to anything;
Jansen…international free agent;
Baez…international free agent;
Fields…acquired from the Astros for a minor leaguer;
So while the Dodgers have made a few great draft picks, I think they’ve built their advantage over the Giants by making better trades and better free agent signings.
They seemed destined to make a big trade this month.
I like the Giants future with out any big trades, think the outfield will be very good by 2019, with no trades, and even better in 2021 with top pick this year ready by then .
tell us why you think the OF will be very good?
I think Shaw can be a Duvall type in LF, I think Reynolds can be a great all around CF, Speed and Power and high average with great glove, he is playing futures game next week for a reason, he is good, I like Slater good ball player . They also have Dugger a good speed guy to be a back up CF if not better, and Quinn is a great hitter with pop, that will be a good corner OF. You either have not done your home work, are do not like them because they all are white !
Besides Lefty, has anyone seen Shaw play? Or are we just reading stats that show he can hit minor league pitchers? Can he field? Is he major league talent?
Maybe he is…I just don’t know what we know
I do not go by Blog Scouts, I go by production !
So, reading stats. Blindly.
Yes, they can not hit MLB pitching until thry face MLB Pitching, Stats are the only thing to go by, Track Record !
Minor league stats, along with the age and experience level of the player at the time, are a pretty good indication of talent. Lincecum, Cain, Bumgarner, Posey and Belt all had excellent minor league numbers. Duvall had better power numbers than anyone had achieved in the Giants’ minor league system in years. Duffy had an excellent year in AA. Guys like Williamson and Parker, and other Giants’ minor leaguers who never made it, just weren’t as impressive in the minors. Even if you’ve never seen him in person, what Shaw has done so far has been impressive.
I have not even seen a picture of him. I tend to mostly ignore our prospects, don’t want to get attached or get hopes up. It weirdly makes me feel bad when someone doesn’t end up “making it”.
The Blog scouts did not like Duvall, he is having a better year this year than last year
You’re still not answering the question.
I did below, they need a chance to prove it, never know until they face MLB pitching .
I just saw him the once, but he really impressed me in LF.
Yup. My point -as I’m sure you gathered – is the way folks around these parts wax poetic about names and numbers on a screen that they have never seen in the flesh is crazy. You actually go watch them. A lot
my answer to your cute little story is the following:
runzler
surkamp
heston
kickham
stratton
Mejia
3/4 years ago these were the names everyone kept saying were the next great Giants pitchers and that out system was chock full of starters, no need to get FA or make trades, a few of these guys would step in post TL, Cain, etc.
Where are they all now?
Exactly, you can name all the OF you want since in stead of pitchers and INF, now it seems the hot de rigueur topic is Giants OF, while ignoring recent Giants drafting trends and the fact the lone OF starter they have developed in 30 years plays for the Reds.
But all of the sudden this braintrust has drafted the 2nd coming of Matthews/Maddox/Foster??!?!?!!? Please be serious.
LOLZ
I liked Bonds / Henderson/ Brown/ better .
Exactly.
So it’s not about tanking. It’s about being smart.
Luckily, the Giants HAVE been smart enough in all areas to have won those titles you don’t always like me to bring up.
The Giants’ history seems to show that they’re not able to find true difference makers unless they’re picking very near the the top. Their most recent title was three years ago now. They were great accomplishments, but that era is over.
You’re forgetting a few guys–Belt and Crawford, who both contributed to the last two titles (5th and 4th rounds), Panik, a sparkplug in 2014 (end of 1st round), Wilson and Romo, in the 20s, and both closers on World Series teams, Vogelsong, Jonathan Sanchez, Cain… Now, obviously nothing matches up with Posey winning the MVP in 2012 or Lincecum winning two Cys and leading the 2010 World Series charge or what Bumgarner did in 2014. But those are all pretty substantial contributions to championships, and it is a team sport.
There’s also Freddy Sanchez, Javier Lopez, Hunter Pence, and Marco Scutaro, all key contributors who were obtained for homegrown prospects.
Oh, and Travis “Bobby Thomson” Ishikawa.
as Oracle said, it’s a new era now.
that era had Sabean all over it, now it’s some kinda collective shit show
It still happened, and you can gush over the Dodgers all you want, but it’s still true that Reagan was president the last time they won a World Series. And that homegrown players (or guys traded for homegrown players) were the heart and soul of those championships.
Whether it’s the Dodgers or some other team really doesn’t matter. What the Giants need to do remains the same.
I’m talking about difference makers. Guys like Crawford, Belt and Panik are good players who contribute to a winning team, but they aren’t Lincecum, Bumgarner or Posey. They’re more easily replaceable.
You tend to unfairly discount the importance of those type of players…the teams that win it all tend to have solid contributions across the board, which is exactly how the Giants did it.
They wouldn’t have done it without Lincecum, Bumgarner and Posey…and Panik, Crawford, Belt, Scutaro, Pence, Pagan, Cain, Vogelsong, Romo, Wilson, Casilla…etc
No, I don’t. The lack of of overall talent is the Giants biggest problem this season.
But many people -maybe you -said the same thing when they DID win.
The lack of performance up to standards by many of their players is as big a problem: these players were NOT playing to standards, and many still aren’t:
Cueto, Bumgarner, Moore, Melancon, Crawford, Pence, Span for starters.
At one point, during the years they won, did they go through a stretch where they went 63-93?
How does that make your point?
You’re making a comparison between criticisms of those teams with criticisms of this one.
No, I’m saying that lack of performance is part of it. As us bad decision making in games, in roster building. It’s bad luck injuries. It’s many things including talent. But you always want to boil all failures down to whatever point you make and nothing else.
There is a litany of contributors to the stretch. As there were a litany of contributors to the winning years beyond the 3 higher draft pick stars
I guess I’m basically confused about what point you and Efrain are making with this kind of comment. The Giants parlayed three straight top-10 picks into three championships, and all three of those were difference-makers in one or more of those titles. So you’re criticizing the Giants for…not being bad enough to get more top-10 picks?
Efrain wants to make comparisons like “Duffy vs Kris Bryant” or “Posey vs Tomlinson” to prove that the Giants draft poorly. Bryant was the #2 pick and Duffy was drafted in the 18th round, and Duffy finished second to Bryant for the 2015 Rookie of the Year. Isn’t that an argument for the Giants being GOOD at drafting?
In my opinion, it’s a more complex picture than just saying the Giants draft well or poorly. The Giants have done quite well with their first-round picks–besides the Big Three, there’s Cain and Panik, and we hope for good contributions from Beede, Shaw, Arroyo, Crick, and even Ramos in a few years. But I think other teams do better generally at finding and developing talent in later rounds, and thus you have guys like Bellinger, Pederson, and even Paul Goldschmidt, who was in the Trout draft but six rounds later. And other teams certainly do better on the international market. And the Giants overpay their own guys and then don’t have payroll flexibility and end up with bad signings like Span and Peavy and Pagan because they can’t afford to go after anyone better. Like I said–it’s a series of intertwined decisions.
Yup
Span is hitting great, Crawford has an OPS of .633, and Pence slightly higher than that .
All season, Peter… all season. Read.
Turning on the Giants leader in Runs, RBI, and HRs, and Extra Base hits, with a OPS over .800 I see .
Not at all. Belt is a good player.
Are they your pick to win it all?
Their rotation is a bit fluky after Kershaw and Wood.
but it’s not about relying on 2 guys for the Dodgers, they have a solid 40 roster AND talent at top levels of the farm, they get by.
They will win the West easily, as I have said for months.
They’ll probably win the division but that doesn’t mean they’re without their flaws.
you can say that just about anybody. no one said they didn’t have flaws.
Atta babe Padres.
Harper, wow. 500000000 brings him to SF in ’19!
We will have a young cheap outfield by 2019, can use Money to fill other holes .
It would be nice to have one star or super star in the outfield. The farm may only produce league average or just above average production outfielders .
Maybe they need more fertilizer down on the farm. Or as Tommy Lasorda once told me, contented cows make better milk.
We will see, I think they are better than that, you have a history of under valuing Giants prospects .
Ramos is going to be a star. And harper is not their kind of guy.
yeah, he’s a real star not a wonder bread choir boy.
Producing 3 league average outfielders would be spectacular. Three Blanco-types would be a haul from the minors.
It would be three times better than anything they’ve done in OF for quite some time.
They just started prioritizing the Outfield the last few years, use to be Pitching and more Pitching
Amen.
And enough shortstops for all the infield positions.
You coulda used commas, ya jerk. ;o)
PJ used them all 🙁
It’s a shout out to Moooooooose
What’s the difference between the MLB.TV Premium subscription and the MLB.TV Single Team subscription? Will I be able to watch Giants games in the bay area with either package? It’s kind of confusing. Both are on sale through the 4th for $20.17 (regularly $112.99 and $87.49). I’d pretty much want to watch only Giants games. Thanks to whoever mentioned the special offer a couple of days ago!
I hate the live blackouts, so you have to wait 90 minutes after the end of the game to watch it.
Favorite ball parks based on visits, pictures and TV of the parks I haven’t been to, classic appearance and views. And other things. For example, I like how Baltimore and Detroit bring their city into the park. So here’s my rankings.
Obviously AT&T is the best.
1 San Francisco
2 Pittsburgh
3 St Louis
4 Detroit
5 Cincinnati
6 Los Angeles
7 Baltimore
8 Colorado
9 Boston
10 Yankees
11 Mets
12 San Diego
13 Cleveland
14 Washington
15 Atlanta
16 Seattle
17 Minnesota
18 Texas
19 Kansas City
20 Anaheim
21 Philadelphia
22 White Sox
23 Houston
24 Cubs (under belly is a dump)
25 Milwaukee
26 Miami
27 Arizona
28 Toronto
29 Oakland
30 Tampa Bay
I’ve been to Coors Field and Petco and thought they were both great parks. They’d both be in my top 10. I went to both Citi Field and Yankee Stadium several years ago and definitely preferred Citi Field. Totally agree with TB being last. I’ve been there, too.
Petco is a pretty cool park no doubt.
I’m shocked that you ranked the Giants’ park #1.
Move LA down to 31st
I know. I just like the way it was constructed in a hole.
And they evicted owners from their homes for the ball park.many were dragged out. They were promised new homes- never got them
It doesn’t bring the city into it at all, but I love Petco. Great site lines, you’re right on the field, there’s a freaking Stone tap room 25 feet from the stadium, and it’s got a great feel live. (And the ticket prices are a dream)
We’re going to the series there right after the All-Star break. Just bought great seats straight from the Padres site for about 40% of what comparable seats would cost at AT & T, or for that matter, Scottsdale Stadium.
They also have a wine bar in the park where you can pick out a bottle (reasonable selection and prices), and they’ll put the wine into a carafe, give you the glasses, and off you go, with some nice wine to enjoy as you watch the game. Extremely civilized.
Plus the fact that there are a cajillion great happy hours right around the park so you can fill up before the game and then you can stroll five minutes back to your hotel in the Gaslamp after the game.
I love me some AT & T Park, but Petco’s a pretty great experience.
I’ve seen games in 16 MLB stadiums, but prior to new Suntrust Park in Atlanta most of them were long ago. And most of them not so enjoyable.
My AT&T first experience, with friends, family and some of y’all…#1 on the bucket list. Hoping to be out there in a couple of years.
And THANK YOU for Arizona so low. What a strange stadium. It’s neverendless county fair food stands and it sounds like a vacuum chamber. Nothing makes a sound in there. No crack of the bat, cheers a quarter of a stadium away sound like they’re miles away, has the lighting of an indoor hotel pool
And it gets muggy in there at times in spite of the forced air.
My list, New Yankee and National Park would be ranked lower.
Agree. I didn’t care for Nationals Park at all.
I’ve been to the Twins park and it is top notch. Personally I would rank it higher than, gasp, the Giants park. Granted, I was there on a perfect weather night but the train goes right to the front door, there is so much more room in the concourse, and the background view of the skyline, while not as nice as Pittsburgh, is pretty nice. The field is great and it doesn’t have stupid quirks such as a 420 foot power alley. They don’t have a giant Coca Cola slide but I’m not one who cares about that. Personally I don’t see what’s all that about AT@T.
Albert Suarez is starting for the AZL Giants tonight. I’d practically forgotten about him. Wonder what happened to make him miss half the season?
His MiLB profile page says the Giants optioned him to Sacramento on 4-1, then on 4-6 Sacramento placed him on the 7-day DL, then on 6-29 Sacramento sent him to the AZL on a rehab assignment. The injury is not stated:
http://www.milb.com/player/index.jsp?sid=milb&player_id=544150#/career/R/pitching/2017/ALL
Missed almost three months; a guy who spent a good chunk of time on the 25-man last year. Strange that we haven’t heard anything about him.
I’ve found out, shoulder injury. Schulman reported it on 4-6:
http://www.sfgate.com/giants/article/Giants-Moore-honored-to-get-home-opener-start-11056652.php
Good get, 12xu.
We could use a legit swingman and MyMan Albert fits the bill.
Suarez didn’t do too hot tonight: 2 IP, 2 runs (both earned), 1 hit (a HR), 1 K, 1 BB. But it was his first game in his rehab. Speaking of swingmen, who is the Giants long reliever now? Gearrin? And who will be when MadBum comes back later this month? Cain?
So is Austin Slater the best OFer developed on the farm since Chili Davis or is too soon to tell?
you know it’s too soon, but he sure isn’t any Gary “Bongo” Brown.
No Bongo. But he seems to have Zildjian cymbals.
And almost everybody wanted him .
Reynolds may be best all around outfielder, in 40 years .5 tools .
Could use a guy like Ian Happ. Wow.
Besides Span, what else could the Cubs use? An infielder? A relief pitcher? A starting prospect like Andrew Suarez? Could Span + ___ get them Happ?
You give in to him way to easy, he loves every teams prospects in MLB over any Giants prospect, his scouting on Duvall looks very shaky, might lose his license over it .
Probably not, but…one can hope. Cubs are very astute and good evaluators of talent. I think they know what they have with Happ, and if they were to move him I don’t think we have the resources to be in the conversation.
That’s my “go get that guy” guy.
Dude. Why have you been posting these insane Jump The Gun questions lately?
Too soon to tell. And don’t forget Nate Schierholz!
He is the standard of the last 30 years. Clear the Nate bar with the Fosbury.
You vaping tonight? I’m digging the irreverence
He still has that .400 babip going, and he may not be Ty Cobb. Yet. Who is the current “Best since Chili?” Marvin Benard? Feel like he gets drug through the mud more than he deserves. He was Gregor Blanco with the hype of “good prospect” instead of “dumpster dive”. Is it Nate? Mike Aldrete? Serious question.
Hard to top Nates D in rf but seems Slater on course to have him licked with the bat.
Dan Gladden
I liked Dan Gladden. Those were dark days for Giants fans, but he was a hard-nosed player that hustled, and he was fun to watch.
i was happy for him when he got his ring(s)? with the twinkies..
Yup, 2, ’87 and ’91. And he played for the Yomiuri Giants in ’94, won a championship there too. One of only 2 players to win championships on 2 continents. Hideki Matsui was the other.
John Bowker .
Really? Good for him. I was reading that off Gladden’s Wikipedia page, wouldn’t have known these facts otherwise.
Loved Dan Gladden too, from Cupertino! Krukow once told a story about a tie game at Candlestick, 9th inning. Gladden, who used to choke up on the bat, got ahead in the count, looked over to the bench, dropped his hands to the knob of the bat and hit a walk-off HR. I was at that game! He now does color commentary for the Twins broadcast.
I remember listening to that game on my car radio!
That’s awesome, Giants memories go back a long way for all of us here at TWG. IIRC, it was on a Friday night. My buddies and I would drive up to Candlestick from San Jose, usually on Friday nights. All 10,000 or so in the stadium were going nuts when he hit it out. Gladden was a hard-nosed guy who always hustled, definitely would have been a MyGuy™ if the blog was around then.
Gladden looked like a gear head. When he was on the Twins, Kent Hrbek tagged him with the nickname Wrench.
I always think of Gladden as same time/before Davis, but this was just before I was watching so I don’t know for sure. I have no memories of either of them live.
Davis 1982, Gladden 1984 .
Gladden made his major league debut on September 5, 1983 (best Chris Berman voice)…I know because I was there!
Chili came up in 1981. It was a big surprise that he made the Opening Day roster. He mostly played LF early on, because Jeff Leonard wasn’t letting anybody take his position.
Chili was optioned for a short time in ’83, but finished the year in SF and made the all-star team in 1984, IIRC. Gladden had a huge second half in 1984. He hit .350 and shot line drives all over the field.
Both Chili and Gladden were essential players on that 1986 team, one of my all-time favorites.
I remember when Gladden came up, choked way up on the bat and hit a stunning array of line drives all over the place then, inexplicably ditched that style the next season and went all the way down the bat and never again hit that well. I think he decided he could hit more homers but he was better suited as a leadoff sparkplug type hitter.
I remember being pissed when SF traded Armando Rios away as part of a deal for some scrub named Jason Schmidt. Thought Rios was legit.
And some young pitcher named Ryan Vogelsong. I don’t even remember him from back then, but I do remember Rios.
Dan Gladden actually
Off topic: how is Paul Millsap making 30 mil per? Who is highest paid, or will be, Warrior?
Curry makes 45.7 Million in the last year of his 5 year deal .
I can’t wait for your criticisms of the way he breathes in that final year.
You love spending other peoples Money, doubt the Warriors stay together for more than 2 more Years , players did not sacrifice that much .
I’d prefer to relax and enjoy the performances and not worry about 2023
2019 actually .
even if the Dubs lose Klay or another piece in 2019, they will be able compete at a high level.
Pete’s a Worrier
And klay just signed a pretty rich endorsement deal with that Chinese shoe company. Basketball money just got even more insane this off season
He has to sacrifice, but Durant and Curry with much bigger endorsement deals do not, get it, you never liked him !
Dude, quit being weird. He certainly didn’t sacrifice at all when he signed his deal a few years back, dwarfing Curry’s salary. Timing is what it is, and Klay will be fine, too
Actually he did, not a max deal, Curry signed his past deal before he are the team knew he was over his ankle injury issues, Steph did not sacrifice the team gambled and won .
Of course. Exactly. And, wasn’t it totally cool that he didn’t go diva and demand a new contract negotiation, but instead lived with his decision? Great dude. I never said he sacrificed. I said he was grossly underpaid. And, he was. No longer. Good for him. I’m not sure why you’re worried about Klay already. Is that all you do? Worry? Enjoy this incredible team.
Oh my gawd. Giants should Pay Harper that much some day
Steph. Which is fine, since he was grossly underpaid prior
Durant taking less so Iguodala could be signed.
Durant getting a 20 % raise this year, and a Max deal like Steph next year, so he will not go hungry !
Well deserved also
You going to pay the 200 Million dollar luxury tax bill and 400 Million dollar total salary in 4 years, gross profit was less tan 100 Million this year with a 100 Million dollar payroll .
Lacob will be just fine. Public claims of profit are dramatically understated
People like to talk about value of a Franchise increasing , the problem with that is you have to sell the team to get that value, and ownership is also paying to build new arena in San Francisco .
Not a bad problem to have. I’m sure they appreciate your concern, PJ.
He sold a lot of records, didn’t he? I prefer Mel Tillis, but . . .
I always took you for a Slim Whitman kinda moose
Elton Britt!
By the way, you are pointing to the residual effects of Warriors Mania by teams…gross overpayments of undeserving talent. The list of overpaid free agents this year is shocking.
Now, I will say that I think Iguodala qualifies as grossly overpaid, but not to the level of Millsap, Korver, Lowry, and many others.
I think Iguodala’s shrewd negotiating, along with LBJ’s comment about Steph’s contract, shows that NBA stars are being savvy about getting their share of the golden eggs that they’re laying. The Warriors’ value has gone from $450 million to $2.6 billion in seven years, and a major part of that appreciation is on the slender shoulders of one Wardell Stephen Curry III. Iguodala wasn’t having it about artificial limits on what he could make. Nor should he.
Oh, I’m definitely in the “Good For Him” camp. Glad he got paid. It’s a ton of money for a 6th man that will be 7th man real soon
I’m just glad he’s back, and we won’t need a GoFundMe for Lacob or Guber, I shouldn’t think.
The Griffin deal is a giant risk for the Clips. Tony Freakin Snell’s deal is crazy. Re Dick getting $23 million next year???? Holy shit
See, you buying those numbers, Value is not cash on hand, you get value when you sell to a new owner, are you get loans on that value, which leads debt, that you must eventually pay .
In other words, PJ is saying he knows less about finance than he does about sports, which is a pretty low bar.
Lets see you buy a 2 Million dollar Yacht without selling your only asset worth 2 Million dollars, and without getting a big time loan with intrest to pay .
I already have 3 2 million dollar yachts. What do I need with another?
I’m guessing Lacob and Guber had lots of money even BEFORE they owned the Warriors and that they still have some left. Just a guess.
You would be wrong, I have seen lists of richest owners in sports and Lacob is not even near the top, Charles Johnson of the Giants is way higher .
He should have bought us a left fielder, then. SMH
Joe Lacob net worth 325 Million, for an owner that is not that much, he is a wheeler and dealer, buys and sells for profit .
That’s an incorrect number, Peter.
What is it than, money expert, he probably has lot of loans , and lots of assets, but cash in his account very low for an owner, he is a self made millionaire, family was not wealthy .
Thankfully, none of us will ever know…nor should we. It’s a private matter, but it’s obvious that the number you listed is some poorly thrown dart by the internet.
Just the Warriors themselves make him worth many times your number, regardless of the loans, assets and cash. Those dudes live in a way different universe of economics.
Just don’t worry about Lacob and Gruber’s money. They have so much future income set under contracts for rights, suites, slaes, etc, that they are willing to pay as much luxury tax as needed. He’s more Eddie D than Lew Wolff
okeedokie
The NBA salary structure is unsustainable. It’s built on the premise that all that ESPN/TNT money will keep rolling in. Millsap is the latest poster guy for that. They’re paying role players $15-20MM annually. Insanity.
Much smaller rosters, though, than in MLB or NFL. The money doesn’t have to spread around as far.
What they said on ESPN lots of Free Agents unsigned and not much money left on the books for teams to spend .
It just boggles the mind that they would pay guys like Reddick and Korver more than $20MM per year. Curry, Durant, LBJ–yeah, I see that. The next level down, not so much.
No, JJ Reddick at $23 million, he deserves it, he earned it, just ask Matthew.
OK Matt, our friends just left, I’m feeling no pain, just joshin’ you.
The Dodgers are probably already tweaking their rotation so that Kershaw starts one of the games against the Giants in the 3-game series July 28-30.
Kenley Jansen is furious with Dodger fans because no Dodger player was voted in as a starter for the All-Star Game. He has a point, but he should be mad at management, whose greed has blacked out most of the fans for going on four years now.
Zack Cozart of the Reds over Corey Seager. Yowza.
http://www.latimes.com/sports/mlb/la-sp-mlb-all-stars-20170702-story.html
Cozart higher OPS way better glove , what is the problem .
Suddenly, PJ is Mr. Slappy!!
Cozart has pop, remember in 2012 the Giants had pitched 4 straight shutouts, and Cozart hit a leadoff HR vs Cain to end the streak .
The Dodgers are the top team in the NL, Cincinnati’s a last-place team, and Seager is 2016 Rookie of the Year and a bonafide star. I’m sure Cozart is having a good year and is deserving, but where are the Dodger fans? That’s the point.
The really wild thing is that defending MVP Kris Bryant didn’t make the team at all.
He is in the final vote, like Belt won last year ., I like it players going on merit instead of reputation .
The EYE test. Plus Seager better feared hitter at the plate.
Heard that comment today on the LA/Padres tv broadcast. LA fans just don’t get the coverage that other teams get. And I’ve heard that same complaint from a buddy in LA. Greed rules the roost.
Justin Smoak, 2010-2016: 0.2 WAR
Justin Smoak, 2017: 2.1 WAR
A player should NEVER publicly be mad at his own team’s fans.
“My ” teams have won a few titles and many have been dreadful. So maybe I’m more sanguine about the whole thing .But I have to say-the winning part is a heck of lot more fun.Good night, all.
Our guy Heliot Ramos came back to earth tonight in the AZL, 0-5 with a K. BA dropped from .700 to .467.
#2 pick, Jacob Gonzalez, son of Luis Gonzalez, is doing as well or maybe even better than Ramos after 3 games. Gonzalez went 3 for 4 yesterday and is now 7 for 11 in 3 games while Ramos is 7 for 15.
Like the start to their careers.
http://www.milb.com/player/index.jsp?sid=milb&player_id=669363#/career/R/hitting/2017/ALL
http://www.milb.com/player/index.jsp?sid=milb&player_id=671218#/career/R/hitting/2017/ALL
Gonzalez is 19 while Ramos is only 17.
Congrats to the Giants bullpen, the MLB “Bullpen of the Week”!
http://m.mlb.com/news/article/240181320/giants-earn-bullpen-of-the-week-behind-dyson/
I’m sure it’s just a coincidence, but it really is something that the Giants have played their best ball this season when Melancon has been on the DL.
and with Austin Slater playing every day in left and grabbing the job, providing youthful athleticism and energy…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oL1AJdA7aI
This is great. Thanks for posting it. Suzanne is one of my all time greats.
Sorry, Ryan, the Giants and Posey are doubling down: He’s a catcher. That’s what happens when you’ve been named to your fifth All-Star team, fourth as the starting catcher, and are also leading the league in hitting at age 30.
http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/07/03/giants-want-buster-posey-to-remain-their-masked-man/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
All hail the great Buster Posey.
I wish I knew why this is such a difficult concept for so many fans to grasp. He’s the best catcher in the sport. He wants to catch. The organization wants him to catch. We have an All Star first baseman at first. It’s a team built on pitching and defense, of which Posey captains. I guess it’s reading those Fangraph charts or something.
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